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Bleeding Hopes Trialzones


Perez

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Hi all, got a second hand pair of TZ, but the rear lever feel a little spongy, spend a hour to bleed it as i usually do on every Hope brake, but never got a firm feel as the front brake is, the only chance to this happens is to put the reach of the lever far from the bars.

Any tip, or maybe any part i need to change?

Thanks in advance.

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Tie the lever to the bar with the brake pressed on and rest the bike on its back wheel so the rear brake hose is all facing up from the rear caliper to the lever. I find putt I Ng the bike on the back wheel and leaning it against a wall works.

Doing this makes any air bubbles in the brake compressed and the smaller bubbles will travel to the highest point hopefully into the lever resevoir after a few hours.

Once you have done this refill the resevoir.

Should feel better.

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Tie the lever to the bar with the brake pressed on and rest the bike on its back wheel so the rear brake hose is all facing up from the rear caliper to the lever. I find putt I Ng the bike on the back wheel and leaning it against a wall works.

Doing this makes any air bubbles in the brake compressed and the smaller bubbles will travel to the highest point hopefully into the lever resevoir after a few hours.

Once you have done this refill the resevoir.

Should feel better.

This and "roll the cypher" (is that how it's spelled?)

I bled mine like a Shimano 775 brake though, meaning from the bottom to the top with a syringe. Also, the rear will always feel a little spongier due to the longer brake hose. I also found that if the brake isn't setup correctly, that is the brake pads touching the rotor evenly, the brake feels spongy.

Edited by niconj
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I did bleed them as a Shimano, from the caliper to the lever, and then closed the caliper and pump the lever to get some air bubbles out, still spongy. Then just filled the reservoir and let the air flow trough the hose, caliper and then out again, more bubbles out, less spongy, repeated several times, felt better but not as i wish, because i don´t like to have the reach of the lever too far from the bars ( im a Shimano guy ).

What i feel is that the diafragm may be not in very good shape, or the interiors of the lever body as well, really really hate .dot oils, mineral should be a law.

Will try to leave the lever pressed for a few hours too see what happens.

By the way, i used dot 5.1, will dot 4 be better?

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I missed a good tip sometimes the air bubbles get trapped so give the hose and caliper a few taps now and again while you have the lever tied up.

This way you should be able to get all the air out of the rear brake.

I always was under the impression the rear was usualy more spongy because there was more surface area in the system to trap air, so more air made the brakes more spongy.

As the hoses are rated to take upto 3000psi and bike hydraulic brakes run much less Than that so don't really flex or expand.

My brakes seem as though they are no different front or rear.

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I don't get why people rant about Dot so much. It's not worse than mineral oil.

Really?

Name an advantage that actually counts in trials use?!

Please don't argue with boiling points.

This is what comes to my mind spontaneously:

DOT...

...brakes are usually harder to bleed (especially when they have no reservoir [avid] and/or you follow the cryptic instructions [Hope/Avid])

...brakes seem to suffer more from defective sealings inside the system than mineraloil brakes [long term use = increasing spongyness, shitty feeling]

...is corrosive to both, the system and your skin [+ your bleed-kit when you don't care enough.. which sucks even more]. I service DOT brakes on a regular basis and what comes out of older Avids (for example) is stunning. You can see tissues floating around in the old fluid which was once DOT and you even struggle to get the old shit out of the system. Older style Maguras (Clara, Louise, Julie), on the other hand, seem to just run like they should (even though the fluid turned grey as well).

I banned DOT brakes from all of my bikes. The only adavantage I ever stumbled across is/was the fact, that a freshly serviced Avid, for instance, has a nice pressure point. But since the latest e.g. Shimanos got the same advantage but with less effort/struggle.. I really don't bother geeting hold of a DOT brake ever again.

P.s. I don't say Mineraloil brakes are free of maintenance, of course not. But they suffer from fewer problems and services are really easy/fast/less likely to require replacement parts

Edited by Martin Direske
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About the "corrosive" part on my skin. I have never had any problems with 5.1 on my skin and I'm not overly careful with it. I was just wondering; the "harder to bleed" part comes from the system and not from the actual liquid you use in your brakes, right?

I don't find Trialzones harder to bleed than, let's say, Shimano 775. It's true though that the newer Shimano brakes are easier to bleed.

.

Edited by niconj
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Why is it that you always have to argue?

DOT is DEFINATELY more corrosive than mineraloil. Period.

It is recommended to wear gloves when handling DOT since it is slightly acidly to your skin. Period.

It clearly wont rip the flesh of your hands, but you shouldn't bath your hands in it for longer than necessary either.

What Adam wrote is what I was summarizing under "cryptic bleeding instructions/procedure". It's just another method, I'm fine with that and it works for sure. I just had a bad time with my V2 back in the day :P

Edited by Martin Direske
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There's no tricks to bleeding them, but you must bleed them 'properly' - that is, as Hope say, not like a Shimano or other brake:

Well, i did this, and the brake works, but i don´t like the gap from where the lever is to when pulled it actually brakes, don´t know if you guys understand what im talking about.

Martin only bike mechanics understand the hate on Dot oils, and Avids, pure evil!

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Mineral oil and dot 5 don't take on water

Mineral oil no, dot 5.1 yes. It's the most hygroscopic brake fluid there is, hence it needs to be replaced more often.

Dot fluid will dry your skin

See above

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I do know what you mean - that is 'fixed' on open system brakes, you can't change it unless you have a lever with bite point adjustment.

This distance is also affect by brake setup (parallel rotor, pads the same distance from both pads, etc).

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo! hate, hate, hate! But the front brake is fine, like my XTR, the rear one has this issue, really tought it was about the bleeding process.

I will have to try to bleed them again just to check one last time, if not i will probably sold them.

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Yes, that´s the thing im struggling with.

Im a bike mechanic, and found this one a little weird, because i bled the brake until no more bubbles come out, spend an hour on this because it´s the first time i will ride with disc brake on the rear, and i don´t feel confident on gaps to rails with this. The brake is very powerfull, with the original pads and at the moment Magura Rotors. The pads are straigh, the rotor is straigh, no bends. The front brake is ok, with the perfect feel and no gap.

I think it might be some issue inside the lever body. Yesterday i e-mail Hope and they answer me with a video of servicing the caliper. Didn´t have time yet to do this, but tomorrow i will bleed it again as well servicing the caliper.

Edited by Perez
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+1 with Bing

Still think mono trials/zones are best with the older Mono Trial rotors from my experience with them.

Will change, im glad that i still have a pair of those around here :D Edited by Perez
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