::cough:: pitbull ::cough:: yes the bb rises have changed again. IMO the high bb frames in excess of +35 mm (so the +50,60 and in the marc vinco frames case +80mm frames) were all too high and caused trouble for taps and gaps to many people. The frame bb heights soared from +10mm to a massive +80mm within the year and i thought that was a bit too much. i reecently purchased a zoo! pitbull 07 long and its alot easier on the backwheel than the 05 but the bb height isnt too high (+25mm , similar to the Ashton justice) max....