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Big Oh No (now With Pics)


PUnK KiD
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Hi,

I've just taken my rear wheel off my echo team 05 frame which i had bought about 2 weeks before christmas and i also bought new magura mounts for select bikes at the same time. i was taking these bolts out of the frame literally minutes ago and sunndenly 3 out of the 4 bolts became tight. My sudden thoughts were "Oh Sh*t have i cross theaded them?" but i remember threading the bolts in until it reached the mount by hand. no i have managed to get the bolts out and i have notice a large bulky build up of aluminiums which looks to of been crushed onto the bolt (on 3 of them, 1 bolt is fine) and when i check the threads i noticed they have been crushed F**K. Am I able to claim a free new one from select bike or something cos the bolts i have used to tighten the maguras on (the ones i bought from select bikes) have reached the bottom of the brake mounts and gone too far on afterwards. and this wasnt even tight enough to hold my magura cylenders in place they keep popping out after a couple of days of riding and they ARE TIGHT.

Major Help Please

Cheers

Tom

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Edited by PUnK KiD
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Mate I know exactly how you feel! I brought an 05 team back in July and had the same problem. I couldn't get the brake cylinders to clamp properly. Every time I tried tightening the bolts the clamps only pinched up a little bit and not enough to hold it tight. So after a lot of pissing around trying to make it work I phoned up Select and they sent me some new mounts and bolts free of charge.

That still didn't fix it so now I have got a couple of metal washers on top of the mounts to prevent the bolts from reaching the bottom of the thread on the frame.

Works fine now, but I expected better from a top company like echo! :ermm:

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Mate I know exactly how you feel! I brought an 05 team back in July and had the same problem. I couldn't get the brake cylinders to clamp properly. Every time I tried tightening the bolts the clamps only pinched up a little bit and not enough to hold it tight. So after a lot of pissing around trying to make it work I phoned up Select and they sent me some new mounts and bolts free of charge.

That still didn't fix it so now I have got a couple of metal washers on top of the mounts to prevent the bolts from reaching the bottom of the thread on the frame.

Works fine now, but I expected better from a top company like echo! :ermm:

yeah and you would expect select to state the problem for future reference cos now my frame is completely F**ked as there is not enough thread of the bolt ot hold properly

Tom (N)

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I think this nearly happened to me, be very very careful but you may be ok to keep using them...

If you know anyone who works professionally in metal, they may be able to drill out the threads, then make a comfy tapped insert that can be slotted into the frame and secured...

Only try to do this if it's really nackered, or try to claim on warranty/guarantee...

Hope this helps,

Nathan (Y)

PS: Fingers crossed it SHOULD be ok... :ermm:

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ive never had a problem with heli coiling a frame or any other material for that matter, probably because i know how to heli coil correctly...............

the best thing in my oppion is to helicoil it, it will last loads longer but get it done at a competent local engineering company

also instead of using washers use shorter bolts

ash

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Helicoiling doesnt screw frames up at all if you do it right, ive had 3 frames helicoiled, all worked perfectly. Even better than normal threads in fact.

By the sounds of it the bolt is too long? Are the threads on the frame really shallow or something? Could you just use a shorter bolt, or are the threads now wrecked?

noz.

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How did it?

helicoil tool snapped inside frame, mate i work for an engineering company and ive been down that road already and yes it was done professionally so im not going the helicoil road again, to be honest if i dont get a replacement frame im not going to bother with trials again cos its cost me about £450 in the past 2 months first for a second hand frame that got f**ked and now for a brand new frame thats has done just about the same.

Tom

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helicoil tool snapped inside frame, mate i work for an engineering company and ive been down that road already and yes it was done professionally so im not going the helicoil road again, to be honest if i dont get a replacement frame im not going to bother with trials again cos its cost me about £450 in the past 2 months first for a second hand frame that got f**ked and now for a brand new frame thats has done just about the same.

Tom

I think thats a slightly childish attitude. (No offence at all meant here). Try helicoiling again, or by all means ask select bikes about a replacement.

Wasting £300 because helicoiling went wrong once is a bit silly seeing as they are definitly better than standard mount threads.

Edited by Hobnobs
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helicoil tool snapped inside frame, mate i work for an engineering company and ive been down that road already and yes it was done professionally so im not going the helicoil road again, to be honest if i dont get a replacement frame im not going to bother with trials again cos its cost me about £450 in the past 2 months first for a second hand frame that got f**ked and now for a brand new frame thats has done just about the same.

Tom

we never have problems with helicoils in our aero engines, so i cant see why your having problems with them in a bike frame? you must of been fairly yanking on the helical insert tool to be able to snap it, either that or it was some real cheap crap, either way they shouldnt break that easily,

if your an engineer then there should be no problem, if not helicoiling simply drill out the thread to 5mm, then tap m6, simple enough...............

your attitude to frame replacement is a little childsish, it is not select bikes or a manufacturing fault, its simply yours for using either the wrong length bolts i.e. being too long......... or cross threading them....

i sugest just repairing the damn thing isntead of moaning on here............ you dont 'quit' just because you cant set your bike up correctly, ive seen lads force incorrect bolts into frames just so they can ride.........

its no reason just to give up because of this

ash

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Yeah i agree, don't give up trials because your bike isn't working like you want it to.. sounds like a case of the sulks to me. :D:shifty:(N)

I know of plenty of people who have helicoiled a frame before and have had absolutley no problems whatsoever, my grandad did a helicoil on my bmx because i didn't know the lugs screwed out and that was fine. But if you work in an engineering company and use helicoils like you say, you should know that.

I don't know if they will give you a new frame on warranty because it is your own fault for using bolts that are too long and then tightening them up so they go into your frame. :closedeyes:

I would suggest that first off you ring select bikes, see what they say about it. You may end up having to ring echo though and send the frame back to them. I'm not saying for sure but i would imagine they might be inclined to either replace it or offer you another at a discount price.

But if they won't replace it or ask you to pay more for another discounted frame i would imagine that you would be able to sell it on here to someone who is competant enough to helicoil it properly, and seeing as its only a couple of weeks old i would imagine that you would get more for it than a discounted frame.

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By the sounds of it the bolt is too long? Are the threads on the frame really shallow or something? Could you just use a shorter bolt, or are the threads now wrecked?

noz.

threads are pretty shallow but as i said in my very first post all the threads are crushed from the lumps on the ends of the bolts

your attitude to frame replacement is a little childsish, it is not select bikes or a manufacturing fault, its simply yours for using either the wrong length bolts i.e. being too long......... or cross threading them....

i sugest just repairing the damn thing isntead of moaning on here............ you dont 'quit' just because you cant set your bike up correctly, ive seen lads force incorrect bolts into frames just so they can ride.........

its no reason just to give up because of this

ash

y is it my fault then for buy a new frame and brake mounts and fitting them? eh? thats all ive done and its f*cked up from there. so it any my fault cos all i have done is set my brake up right and it popped out and theni reset my brake re tightened it and when i was givin my bike a check over i loosened off my brake mount bolts and they got tight so i decoded to take them out to have a look at them.

I don't know if they will give you a new frame on warranty because it is your own fault for using bolts that are too long and then tightening them up so they go into your frame.

is it my own fault that selectbikes sent me the too long bolts when i bought the mounts off them then?

Cheers

TOm

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im sorry but it seems that you are in the wrong, i mean, select bikes arent psychic and know your not running a booster, plus thats the bolts that come pre packaged with the mounts, did you specify short bolts?? no, so quite whining about your mistake and get over it!!

Ben

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im sorry but it seems that you are in the wrong, i mean, select bikes arent psychic and know your not running a booster, plus thats the bolts that come pre packaged with the mounts, did you specify short bolts?? no, so quite whining about your mistake and get over it!!

Ben

not running a booster cos the echo frame has one built in, didnt specify short bolts but neither did they, so why does that put me in the wrong?

and how am i supposed to know as i bought it as a new frame???

TOm

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Surely you couldve nipped a few mill off the end of the bolts with a hacksaw and a file when you realised they were too long?

ive only found out they were tooo long now. cos they just baout going in to hold the brake calipers on, so the first few times they moved i thought i wasnt doing them up tight enough bit late to gring them down now.

Tom

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Surely you couldve nipped a few mill off the end of the bolts with a hacksaw and a file when you realised they were too long?

Although he would then have to lightly grind the screws to a taper, he still could have done that (Ive done it)

These threads (no pun intended ;) ) really irritate me "Ooh I've messed up, can I get a replacement" There are so many alternative ways round (also known as bodges) solutions that so many people give up straight away

Helicoil is a perfect solution. Its so simple I've done it myself, with no experiance of tapping or any mechanical background. My magura is saved and morks perfectly.

I suggest you look at helicoiling AGAIN.....

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I know its easy to be wise after the event, but its quite easy to see if theyre not tight, there shouldnt be any real gap between the mounts. They look dry as well, i take it you didnt use any grease on them?

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