Hi, thanks for the info.. for a while I've thought the rear mech was bent.. when I first had the problems (obivously I stopped riding it and got it checked) the rear mech seemed to hit the spokes.. my neighbour said it was just adjusted wrong (halfords special! ) and I let him adjust them, they worked fine after that and nothing touched anywhere else, all gears except the outter cog worked fine... and now it keeps slipping off.. it's done it 4 times tonight now.. I was out a minute ago just in my garden, my balance improved and I was working on some backward hop things (the first tutorial on the website that brought me here.. ) can only get about 6 inches off the floor but it's a start It's off again now and I've left it, got a bit annoyed with it to be honest might get one of those chain guide things to see if that helps out. I'll adjust it up some more and hope it works fine until I can afford a proper trials bike... Oh and a slightly funny story from a bit of riding earlier this evening.. I was practicing wheelying up to a obstacle (in this instance a 1.5 ft high brick wall) and then pulling the back wheel up onto it.. nothing amazing but just a bit of newbie practice.. was doing it for a bit... then I done it again but dropped the wheel just before the wall, hit the wall with the front tyre and the wall collapsed. OOPS! Thanks Charel and everyone else for validating me, nice to be able to post where I want now As I have no decent trials pics I'll just post a couple of me on my CBR600 motorbike.. but as soon as I get good enough to have a trials picture taken I'll post some of them too Not quite the same I know, but motorbikes are what got have gotten me into trials biking so anything with 2 wheels is good to me Thanks again.