Attn: All Drivers

[Badboy]

My father brought this to my attention.

This is a petition against a proposed new tax from the government.

This tax will affect everyone who drives, anywhere!

Basically this tax will cost you per mile, on every journey. This will be on top of all the tax you already pay on your car. Fuel tax, road tax, VAT etc etc.

LINK HERE

From the site:

The idea of tracking every vehicle at all times is sinister and wrong. Road pricing is already here with the high level of taxation on fuel. The more you travel - the more tax you pay.

It will be an unfair tax on those who live apart from families and poorer people who will not be able to afford the high monthly costs.

Please Mr Blair - forget about road pricing and concentrate on improving our roads to reduce congestion.

So everytime you drive to work, or to go anywhere to ride, your car will be tracked an you will be taxed on how far you have driven.

Apologies if you dont care, or arent bothered about this. But i for one dont think that the motorist should have to pay more an more taxes everytime you turn the key an pull out of your drive!

[Fish-Finger-er]

this is kind of old news, government have been planning it for ages, its just going to cost billions to implement. but the idea is, its meant to replace road tax.and other duties, which i can see the sense in, providing its at a similar cost for average mileage.(i.e £170 a year on a 1500cc or above car doing 12,000 miles per annum). and on that idea i think its a good idea, great aunt ethel who does 1800 miles a year, should not be paying the same rate as someone like me who does 15,000 a year, as i obiviously should be paying more towards road maintenance as i use them more. also theres cars in our work place, who do 60,000 a year. and as for delivery vans etc that do 350 miles a day. who should be charged signifiacantly more than me.

i only agree on it, if it doesnt increase costs to the average motorist(i.e doing 12,000 a year, you shouldnt pay any more than you do now).

if they use it as they also plan on using it, for congestion charges though, thats purely a money spinner. the reason people drive the road they drive, at the time they drive it, is cos they use it. the m6 junctions 11-8 are hell every morning from 7.30am-9.30am, but everyone needs to be using that route, and even at gridlock, it is clearly the quickest way without going through residential areas, so charging people £1 a mile on that stretch of road, generally wont decrease the amount of traffic. it will just increase government revenue, and unless its spent on improving that road, so its less congested. then i dont see its just to pay for it.

also having gps in every vehicle, is a bad idea, as how long till we get fines via post, which are handed out from the eye in the sky, it knows how fast your going, on what road, at what time, can hand out speeding fines nice and easy. no cameras, no traffic police, no safety camera partnerships needed. can hand you out a fine for going to fast down a duel carriageway at 3 in the morning(and im talking 71 mph here if needed). when theres no one round

[Badboy]

Very true, as long as they do remove road tax. But will they?

The dartford bridge for example has paid for itself now. The cost of the toll has paid for the building costs of the bridge, but the government has seen how much money the bridge makes on a daily basis (millions) so have they got rid of the charge now the bridge is paid for, NO. have they dropped the price, NO. Its just another way of the government making more money.

also having gps in every vehicle, is a bad idea, as how long till we get fines via post, which are handed out from the eye in the sky, it knows how fast your going, on what road, at what time, can hand out speeding fines nice and easy. no cameras, no traffic police, no safety camera partnerships needed. can hand you out a fine for going to fast down a duel carriageway at 3 in the morning(and im talking 71 mph here if needed). when theres no one round

Big Brother is watching you. Easy way to make money.

There is also another proposed charge in the making. now this is a good one. The LEZ (low emmisions zone) Anyone who drives a vehicle inside the M25 will have to pay this charge. Now at the moment they are proposing it for 4x4's, vans an lorries. The cost? £250 per day. If you dont pay expect a fine of upto £1000 in the post. If this works an goes into action then there is nothing to stop the government implementing it in other cities. Manchester, Birmingham, Bristol etc etc.

If you dont think that this will affect you, how is everything in this country delivered? by van or lorry! Just watch the price of everything go up!

[matthewholdsworth]

agree with trials-punk for the majority.

the government has to pay for its war somehow! and as queen once famously said "get on your bike and ride" there are alternatives available, expecially in the cities, where i live buses run hourly and there is no train station nearby but i still agree with tax as u go policy. im unemployed at the moment and so am on my XC bike to save on petrol while i job hunt, its painful in this weather but cant afford to drive so ill jsut have to get fit.

the speeding issue does concern me because who doesnt rag the hell out of their car when they can. i drive a 1.6 focus its hardly fuel efficient tax is expensive so its goin to be off the road at the end of the month. these things happen if you dont agree dont vote for them next time around

[munkee]

Vote conservative

[Badboy]

Vote conservative

[matthewholdsworth]

bad news folks just reading about this in the telegraph this morning and apparantly all major parties support some form of legislation regarding "demand management" although the tories havent backed a nationwide scheme.

there will most likely be ways of exempting yourself eg nurses for there jobs i would have thought

[Tomm]

I don't really see it as a problem. It's just a fairer way of working out road tax and cutting down on emissions, congestion etc. There's no need to get up in arms about it, is there?

[Rich Pearson]

Vote conservative

It doesn't matter who you vote for, you always get the government.

I'm f**king pissed to be brutally honest. Not just about this. Every f**king day I hear about yet another thing the government is doing to take away our freedoms; Banning smoking. Banning hunting. Even the goddamn pint, one of the most recognised symbols of the last three hundred years of Bristish heritage, is being desecrated.

And now this. I really hate to say it and sound so militant, but the whole idea of government is f**king stupid.

Sorry, I hate being so base and pathetic in my wording, but it really makes me angry when these people are supposed to be our voice to the world, and even though we don't like it, most of us are too overweight to get out of our armchairs and do something about it.

It's like we've been given just enough rope to hang ourselves with.

Rich

[F-Stop Junkie]

I don't really see it as a problem. It's just a fairer way of working out road tax and cutting down on emissions, congestion etc. There's no need to get up in arms about it, is there?

There's a couple of problems with the new system:

1) To charge by the mile requires all cars to be fitted with tracking devices, which would cost a fortune. Each person would have to be registered, bills sent, debts chased, it would end up costing a fortune. What happened if you turned the tracker off, would you drive for free?

We currently have a system where a flat tax is paid to own a vehicle (not to pay for the road!), then you're charged by the mile with big taxes on fuel. The more you drive, the more you pay in tax. Then every so often Shell, BP, Texaco and the rest pop a huge cheque in the post, and the tax is collected. Simple and efficient.

2) If someone knows how far you've gone and in what time, then (theoretically) as soon as you exceed the speed limit, an instant fine would be dispatched. Do you effectively want to be tagged at all times? What happens to those records? If you were implicated in a crime, the Police could call up all your car's previous movements, and then start going to places where the car had stopped. You could end up with little or no privacy.

3) What's to stop insurers demanding copies of your vehicle's data? They'd then be able to use it against you to try and avoid paying out.

4) What happens to the money raised? Would it pay for better roads? More police? More than likely, it would end up paying for the system to collect the revenue raised in the first place.

5) The idea of charging by the mile is that you scrap either vehicle tax or fuel duty. The average driver then ends up paying the same amount over a year's motoring. Would a government scrap the tax? Would the average motorist end up paying more?

6) How often would you be billed? How would you know how much you owed each month or quarter? What would happen if you couldn't pay or ran up a bill greater than you expected?

Given the Government's track record with big IT projects, I can't see the working. If it's attempted then it'll end up wasting an awful lot of money.

[Tomm]

Words+words

Yeah, I agree; it's a bureaucratic nightmare, but that's a completely different thing. I don't really agree with the big brother style state that might happen, but that's not really the point of this post. Aren't there already speed cameras that track your number plate? Surely if the government wanted, they could quite easily pinpoint someone's movements?

People will moan about a lot of things. I reckon that most people on here will do less-than-average mileage and so should benefit from this system, if it was introduced. But that doesn't stop them moaning

[F-Stop Junkie]

Yeah, I agree; it's a bureaucratic nightmare, but that's a completely different thing. I don't really agree with the big brother style state that might happen, but that's not really the point of this post. Aren't there already speed cameras that track your number plate? Surely if the government wanted, they could quite easily pinpoint someone's movements?

People will moan about a lot of things. I reckon that most people on here will do less-than-average mileage and so should benefit from this system, if it was introduced. But that doesn't stop them moaning

Privacy is a basic right, and while you can be tracked to an extent, do you want the coppers to know that you're stationary in a country lane for 45 minutes a couple of times a week? Would you want the Police to be able to find you at any time?

As either Jefferson or Lincoln said "Those willing to trade liberty for security deserve neither."

You're right, that people doing less than average miles (and don't forget that driving to competitions, shows and rides really adds up!) should pay less tax, I'm sure that most people on TF would end up paying more than they are now.

One other problem with paying per mile is that there's a natural environmental bonus. Those who drive small cars which are efficient effectively get a tax break by paying less for petrol and road tax. A small car which did 5mpg would pay more to the Government in fuel tax than a hybrid or electric car. Therefore penalising the gas guzzlers - one prong of the Government's plan, and something harder to do with per-mile charging.