Mark W Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 Think about it like a 'normal' trials bike. Trials bikes over time have switched to having shorter CS lengths and higher BBs, and it's the same deal for 24" bikes too. The shorter rear end makes it pull up easier for bunnyhops/manuals and stuff like that, but also means it's a little easier on the back wheel. Similar deal with the BB height too - when I rode my 2011 Fourplay with it at it's normal BB height of +20mm I wasn't too keen, but I messed with the dropouts and got it to around +25mm and it felt a lot nicer. I went from the original Fourplay frame (385mm) to a Fourplay 2011 (380mm) to my Arcade (364mm) and found that each decrease in CS length felt better for both BMXy stuff and for trialsy stuff, and found that around a +25mm BB was the one too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 Think about it like a 'normal' trials bike. Trials bikes over time have switched to having shorter CS lengths and higher BBs, and it's the same deal for 24" bikes too. The shorter rear end makes it pull up easier for bunnyhops/manuals and stuff like that, but also means it's a little easier on the back wheel. Similar deal with the BB height too - when I rode my 2011 Fourplay with it at it's normal BB height of +20mm I wasn't too keen, but I messed with the dropouts and got it to around +25mm and it felt a lot nicer. Hmmm.. Okey! So you would say that the fourplay is a bit more what I'm after? Worth to mention is that I probably won't bunnyhop it. It will be treated a bit like a 'normal trials bike', but I will deffo mash in a lot of street but not bunnyhops haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 If you're not bunnyhopping a 24 you're doing it wrong As video evidence will testify I used to pedal-up everything, but bunnyhopping is a lot easier with that kind of geo, feels a lot better and is sort of more versatile for streety stuff too. If you get your technique dialled in you can do it from pretty short/tight run-ups too so it's not even like you've got to have a big run-in and pedal loads to make it happen. I'd always go for the Fourplay over the Element due to the geo, but the main difference is price really. If you can afford to go for a Fourplay I would because the standard spec is better overall and they just feel nicer to ride. If you're unsure and want to commit less money to it the Element is still a good bike. I know a few people who ride Elements who really like them, but personally I'm more of a fan of the Fourplay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 If you're not bunnyhopping a 24 you're doing it wrong As video evidence will testify I used to pedal-up everything, but bunnyhopping is a lot easier with that kind of geo, feels a lot better and is sort of more versatile for streety stuff too. If you get your technique dialled in you can do it from pretty short/tight run-ups too so it's not even like you've got to have a big run-in and pedal loads to make it happen. I'd always go for the Fourplay over the Element due to the geo, but the main difference is price really. If you can afford to go for a Fourplay I would because the standard spec is better overall and they just feel nicer to ride. If you're unsure and want to commit less money to it the Element is still a good bike. I know a few people who ride Elements who really like them, but personally I'm more of a fan of the Fourplay. Hahah, knew you would say something like that! My technique is to bad though for bunnyhops, so I guess I'll just pedal upp everything untill I learn it. Yeah the geo seems a bit nicer on the Fourplay. But having vee brake mounts wouldn't be totally wrong... Thanks for your help btw! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 No worries I found that bunnyhops were a mental thing. I used to have a 'block' where I thought I wouldn't be able to do them, or wouldn't be able to do them up certainly height objects, but then I just started trying them more and realised how much easier it was. When you're pedalling up something on a 24 you're pretty much doing a bunnyhop anyway, so you might as well commit to one properly Just start small and work your way up. Bunnyhop hooks also feel nicer too Having used disc brakes on my own 24 and ridden other 24s with rim brakes, I don't think I'd ever go back to rim in all honesty. Discs just work better for what I use them for on a 24, and there isn't really a plus point for rim brakes that overcomes the negatives. There are upgrade pads for pretty much every type of disc brake out there, and some really good rotors too, so you can tweak any setup to get it to good. It's not like the old days where there were no aftermarket pads and you only had a limited amount of suitable rotors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 No worries I found that bunnyhops were a mental thing. I used to have a 'block' where I thought I wouldn't be able to do them, or wouldn't be able to do them up certainly height objects, but then I just started trying them more and realised how much easier it was. When you're pedalling up something on a 24 you're pretty much doing a bunnyhop anyway, so you might as well commit to one properly Just start small and work your way up. Bunnyhop hooks also feel nicer too Having used disc brakes on my own 24 and ridden other 24s with rim brakes, I don't think I'd ever go back to rim in all honesty. Discs just work better for what I use them for on a 24, and there isn't really a plus point for rim brakes that overcomes the negatives. There are upgrade pads for pretty much every type of disc brake out there, and some really good rotors too, so you can tweak any setup to get it to good. It's not like the old days where there were no aftermarket pads and you only had a limited amount of suitable rotors. Yeah that sounds like me... It's just a block for me and I can only bunnyhop onto small things. I will learn them as soon as I get a bike haha I've used them all aswell, just loooove the feel of vee's. And there's something in me that likes to try new pads and try new grinding disc's etc.. I just love that! I know that disc brakes are much better though on everything pretty much, but when I rode a Fourplay team for 2 days under a show (the full green one), I didn't like how the hope brakes performed. They didn't have anough hold for my liking either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 Was that a new bike though? The reason I ask is that disc brakes do take a little while to bed in and get to their best so if it was straight out the box it might not feel too good. The caliper setup can have an impact too - things like facing mounts and so on. With my Saints, I found even being a little skewed made the brake feel completely different and reduced or improved bite and hold. Luckily I had an Adam Read around whenever I was tinkering with my brakes so he'd just step in and make them awesome Are you bunnyhopping up things to two wheels or to back wheel? I found learning to do it to two wheels helped me with getting it higher to rear (although that was just like doing it on my old mod really), but more importantly for doing it to front. Bunnyhops to front are another fun trick to do and help link stuff up really well, and then allow you to start doing 180s up to front and stuff like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 Was that a new bike though? The reason I ask is that disc brakes do take a little while to bed in and get to their best so if it was straight out the box it might not feel too good. The caliper setup can have an impact too - things like facing mounts and so on. With my Saints, I found even being a little skewed made the brake feel completely different and reduced or improved bite and hold. Luckily I had an Adam Read around whenever I was tinkering with my brakes so he'd just step in and make them awesome Are you bunnyhopping up things to two wheels or to back wheel? I found learning to do it to two wheels helped me with getting it higher to rear (although that was just like doing it on my old mod really), but more importantly for doing it to front. Bunnyhops to front are another fun trick to do and help link stuff up really well, and then allow you to start doing 180s up to front and stuff like that. Well basically both where a bit used, one more than the other. The green one's brakes worked best so I chosed that haha, but there was a blue one aswell where the brake's wheren't as good as the green one. And I problems getting onto objects because of the brake slipping quite a lot (On the green one) Worth to mention is that both bikes where factory spec'd Inspired fourplay team's 2013. I know how to properly set up disc brakes though Ehm, to both I think. Well, I suck on them because I've never really tried doing them. Should be my thing to really learn under the winter I guess! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 This is one video that really makes me want a Element because this is the type of riding I want to do mostly! But yeah, foreplay seems to be what I'm after really, let's see what I can afford Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 Lest we forget David Sellero: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted December 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 That was amazing haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted December 24, 2013 Report Share Posted December 24, 2013 also bare in mind euan's set up was shit for static stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williams Posted January 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2014 (edited) So for anyone that's interested in what I ended up buying, and also (mostly) for other people who might have the same question: I ended up buying the Inspired Fourplay Pro. And after ridden the Element just a day before I got my own bike: My god, I'm so glad I went for the Fourplay. The avid brakes are actually really REALLY good. They can't really compare to saints, but they are definetely compare-able to hope's no doubt. My biggest doubt (except the brakes) was the freewheel, which needed some bedding in, but it's quiet and seems to be really good aswell, no skippings' sofar! Absolutely looooove the bike. The only problems I had was that the front brake started screaming alot today, tried a different rotor and that seems to have stopped the squeeeeky brake. The thing that surprised me most though was how stiff the whole bike is (coming from a Echo 24"). Feels amazing haha. Worth to mention is that I'm not that handicapped on the static moves aswell, which is good. Edited January 8, 2014 by williams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Leigh Posted February 22, 2014 Report Share Posted February 22, 2014 Hahah, knew you would say something like that! My technique is to bad though for bunnyhops, so I guess I'll just pedal upp everything untill I learn it. Yeah the geo seems a bit nicer on the Fourplay. But having vee brake mounts wouldn't be totally wrong... Thanks for your help btw! learn on the bike you've got, if a fourplay is gonna be an upgrade from the bike you've got now, you'll probably progress quicker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HippY Posted February 22, 2014 Report Share Posted February 22, 2014 dude, check your previous post, and the dates 3 month old thread Williams said in January that he went with Fourplay pro and he loves it , literally the post above yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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