Billy mya friend.........no your right the new style plazzys are not as good as older sets...... either way both zoo pads and plaz work better on a smooth rim with tar .i wont recomend you that set up though this time of year... rock pad blues backings tend to snap mate........invest in koxx croco pads medium to a harsh grind ...... Dave x my grinds last about 2 months.........coupple of rides a week