Calm down, Was just describing what it was like, a bike made of cheese, ive ridden bikes with some flex, at the brake mounts, but none that twisted bent and rattled like that thing. I wouldnt really call it a prototype, more of a design model that failed. 2 Plates of metal held together by... what 5 bolts you had in it, for the main part of the frame. And 2 for the rear triangle... 2 bolts was it? or 4 holding that on? And you could twist the whole frame with your hands!!!! And ill think you find lots works first time. If you plan and think about it properly, there may just be things that could improve. So ok let me re-phrase the question i asked - Same geo as your other proto? Just with tubing and not plates of cheese?