Scoox

I want to review this old thread because the Echo SL fork is still called Echo SL fork in 2012, however the design has changed significantly. I have right here a brand new Echo SL fork and a brand new Echo Urban fork. The steerer tube of the SL fork is actually thicker than the steerer tube of the Urban fork, because it is internally butted, and it feels rather solid. By contrast, the Urban fork steerer tube has a uniform cross section throughout its length. In addition, the the SL fork blades meet the steerer tube at a more shallow angle which means more weld/contact area, whereas in the Urban fork that angle is closer to 90°, resulting in less weld area and in theory a weaker fork, at least at the junction. I actually requested the Urban fork from the Echo factory as a replacement for the SL that they supplied with the whole bike. I am supposed to return the SL fork to them, and now that I can compare the two side by side, I might change my mind as the new SL fork is much better designed than I imagined. But somehow the Urban fork still doesn't look like it's going to brake any time soon. I guess both are good forks.

Thanks for replying. First, sorry but how is this the wrong location? This thread is about brakes and so was my question. Second, brake physics hasn't changed for the past... 40 years? So my post and the thread stay relevant. I assure you there isn't a 'thread resurrection' conspiracy. If you believe this thread should not be active and if it bothers you so much when people reply to old threads, how come you are still subscribed to it? Heck, why do you even bother replying?? Shouldn't you be contacting an admin to request this thread be deleted, as it's so old and therefore useless? Your reply actually contained useful information, and this information will still be valid for a long time, so other people might find it useful. I guess it has become politically correct to criminalize people who reply to old threads.

I have a silly yet interesting question regarding disc brakes, specifically rear disc brakes which are very rare on 26-inch trials bikes. I just stumbled upon where a man named Toni Bou pulls some massive moves on his trials motorbike. I didn't think about it at first, but then I realised that the rear brake was a disc brake and the wheel was about 26 inches in diameter, and the rear brake on that motorbike seemed to lock up pretty solidly. So if this is possible on a motorbike, which is a lot heavier than a trials bicycle, why are rear disc set-ups so rare on 26" trials bicycles? Is this to do with the fact that the motorbike wheels are more rigid?

I have inspected the brake more closely and it seems like it's a quality control issue. I dismounted the brake and first found that the plastic backing of the brake pad rubbed against the metal of the brake slave. I filed the plastic down and it worked great i.e. fast recoil. But when I mounted the brakes they were slow again. Mounting the slave as far as possible from the rim resulted in faster recoil, so I concluded that the clamps deform the slave body which increases friction between the piston and cylinder thus causing slow recoil. Although the front disc brake works great right now, I foresee problems down the road because the brake is supplied with no maintenance instructions, the big orange dial on the side seems to require a special tool to turn it, and it's hard to get spares where I live, so I am almost definitely going to go for an Avid BB7 up front and Avid vees at the back. I will still contact Echo and hopefully get them to swap the brakes for something else e.g. a set of silver Urban forks.

I just received my brand-new Echo 24 mk1 which comes with TR brakes. I am very impressed by the quality of this bike so far. The front brake (TR disc brake) is actually really nice, it's not quite bedded in yet but it's already feeling very very sweet and responsive, offering loads of modulation and bite when required. The rear brake (Echo TR rim brake) is another story, at least the one I got: the recoil speed is waaaay too slow, so that if I release the lever suddenly I can see the pads slowly pulling back into the slave cylinders (very very slowly), which means that when I release the lever the rear wheel is not able to spin freely. If the pads are very close they sort of wedge in and still provide quite a lot of braking power even though the lever has been released. Interestingly, there was a copy of the "Echo Magazine" inside the box showing Chinese riders doing some pretty massive stuff, and they all run Echo TR rim brakes on the rear, so I have a feeling I may have been unlucky with mine. I called Echo today but they told me to call back again on February 2nd as the guy who would be able to help me was off for Chinese New Year and they wouldn't be able to help me till then. I will post back as soon as I get a reply. Also the Echo TR lever design has its pros and cons. The main disadvantage is that it's held in place by a bolt and a nut rather than a bolt that screws directly into the brake lever body. As a result, you need one hand to do the bolt, one to do the nut and one to hold the lever in place while tightening it up, so it's pretty hard to do basically. The advantage of this design is that the brake lever can be fitted either way up and it still looks exactly the same. Also,by using a separate bolt and nut there is no risk of stripping out the thread (if you do you just buy a new nut and bolt for a few pence), unlike other brake lever where the bolt screws directly into the brake lever body without using a nut.

Has this tyre been discontinued? Tartybikes don't seem to stock them anymore.

I am afraid I don't, where does he live? I am near Shanghai...

Here in China one set of Echo SL rim brakes costs 750 Yuan whereas a set of Magura HS-33s can be purchased for 638 Yuan. So it is not always the case that Western products are more expensive in China. Maybe the Echo SL brake is a lot better than Magura? I recently paid a visit to a Beijing retailer and he recommended the Maggies over the Echo brakes, although he does stock both. It could be that the Chinese tend to believe that foreign products are of higher quality, particularly German products. I am still going to buy the Echos just because I am curious, having used Maggies my whole trials life I would like to compare and post my thoughts on this forum. As for the new 2011 frames, they look the dogs in my opinion. I think the new Zoo! incorporates everything I wished the Piranha had, so I can't wait for them to become available. Don't know whether Echo will release the new models to the Chinese market first and then the foreign market or the other way round, as the foreign market is probably larger. I also wonder if they plan to release upgraded 2011 hubs too, I'd like to see wider flange 135mm rear hubs, more like the Try-All 'H' hub, which would give better chaing alingment and a stiffer rear end.

I am drawn between the Try-All 'H' and the Echo SL hub for my new build. What's the Try-All 'H' like? Do you know the diameter of the axle and what it's made of?

I like it a lot, your bike has surely been shown some luv, and every time I see a dual-disc set-up like yours I drool. Too bad here in China one can only get hold of Chinese parts easily, therefore I cannot run Hope discs on mine as spares would be a PITA to get hold of.

I am looking for a set of tyres myself for my first stock and was too looking at the Try-All Sticky. Duncy H, how do you feel about these tyres now?

I was trying to choose a bottom bracket, but now I am trying to figure out how the heck they manage to put the ball bearings into the integrated races! Looking at those cut-aways it looks like one fiddly job!

Really nice bike you've got there mate. I also like cable brakes: simple and low-maintenance. I came across this thread because I am choosing parts to build a stock bike and I quite like the Zhi Z3R frame. Just now I was looking at various rear hubs and the Echo SL 135mm seemed to be a nice choice. But then I saw the horizontal dropouts on the Z3R frame and thought: hang on a minute, that frame is going to need snail cams, and snail cams add width to the hub. Furthermore, looking at Echo's website I realised that non of their stock bikes use snail cams. However, you use snail cams on your Z3R and you run an Echo TR rear hub (which probably has the same dimensions as the Echo SL hub), so I was wondering if you could tell us whether you experienced any problems fitting the rear wheel, and whether you had to pull the dropouts outwards in order to fit the wheel, to allow for the extra width added by the snail cams. I am also curious as to why you chose a V!Z front hub over an Echo hub, especially when you already run an Echo on the rear. Maybe you could briefly point out any significant differences regarding quality of these two brands, or basically what is good about the V!Z hub and what's good about the Echo TR hub. All the best!

Hello I am Manuel and I am about to start riding again after a 5 year break. I started riding a Monty X-Hydra mod back in the UK, Exeter, and I didn't like that bike. Now I am going to get a stock as I love the idea of bigger wheels (been doing a few mad things on my roady lately...). I am drawn between the following frames (any suggestions?): - Zhi Z3R 26" - Neon Bow 2010 26" - Neon Wing 26" I now live in Wuxi, China and I can say two things about China: 1) Made in China bikes are obviously a lot cheaper here and 2) China has much better riding spots than Exeter. I swear some places look as if they had been designed specifically for trials. In the UK they design things to discourage street sports, whereas here there is not much of a street sports culture therefore they don't worry about it and everything is peachy. If there are any riders around here it'd be nice to meet. Great forum by the way!

I think when we talk about a best trials bike, we would mainly be talking about the frame, because all the other bits can be used on any other frame. So the original poster probably is after a frame that: Is strong, but not too heavy Has little flex Has a comfortable geometry Feels stable Assuming price is not an issue, this should be a fairly easy question to answer. At least we can say which frames we don't like! I have snapped a Monty frame. Montys are cool and feel nice but I don't think they are particularly strong and durable. They are designed for pro riders who can have a new bike for every competition. Furthermore, they are massively overpriced. The price you pay for too light a frame is more flex and less durability. One day they'll make frames out of tinfoil. So, unless you are loaded, stay away from anything too light. For a beginner I'd recommend Chinese brands like Echo and Neon because these will give you more bang for the buck and the quality of the parts is actually very good. I've been riding a friend's Echo recently and I quite like it. Interestingly, here in China trials bikes are very inexpensive. For example, the Zoo! Lynx frame (which I am thinking about buying) can be purchased for a mere 48GBP delivered, a real bargain! Of course in China that's quite a bit of money which is why hardly anybody here owns a Koxx or a Monty!

I think when we talk about a best trials bike, we would mainly be talking about the frame, because all the other bits can be used on any other frame. So the original poster probably is after a frame that: Is strong, but not too heavy Has little flex Has a comfortable geometry Feels stable Assuming price is not an issue, this should be a fairly easy question to answer. At least we can say which frames we don't like! My previous trials bike was a 20" Monty X-hydra 219. I broke the chain twice and it had a lot of flex. I am Spanish but I wouldn't buy monty again, I think they are too weak. They are made for pros who can have a new bike for every competition, so I would stay away from Monty and Koxx. I would stay away from anything too light. At least there will be members of this forum who can attest to