Trials Scene & Influence In The Uk

[nek0]

I'm trying to find out some information so please bare with me.

I'd like to know roughly how many trials riders are out there in the UK. I realize cycling in general is big in Europe whereas here in the US people didn't hear much about cycling until Lance Armstrong had a strong media coverage for his consecutive wins at Tour de France. Leaving the roadies aside...trials of course, only a handful have heard of it. In a sense it's great considering the possible growth of the sport in the US but growth wise, it's been very slow and sometimes I wonder if it's declining.

What I'd also like to know is, how the trials scene is actually growing, whether it's:

• Influenced by just riders
• Media coverage
• Local bike shop & other online retailers' support
• Support by riders parents/families & general public
• Riders eager to making the sport bigger
• or other reasons

I'd like to hear your ideas as well as personal experience. It's a long shot but any input is appreciated!

[Radfax]

not 100% if this is the sort of answer you are looking for or not but hey here it goes!

I think trials in the UK is growing fairly rapidly considering when i started riding abour 5-6 years ago the trials scene was no where as big as it is now. there were no trials specific frames, there were no trials specific parts, just parts which we could use for trials, like the old D521's FSA powerpro cranks ect so i think using trials parts as a way to gauge and the way they have developed over the years and the way that they are selling so well with people demanding even better parts that trials in the UK is not dead! But compared to XC free ride, downhill and BMX trials is just getting going!

I first got into trials seeing edd tounge (I think ) riding a green and white pashley 26mhz with martin Ashton (i think) in MBUK in about 2001/2 ish, when i see this i was determined to start riding and at that time trials wasnt big at all, there was practicaly no coverage apart from a page or two in MBUK now and again (untill hop-idol started and there was 4 pages a month ) so the coverage was pretty shit! The trials coverage started to get a bit bigger a few years later when there was websites such as trials kings which used to be a few 20 second long clips of a few riders, think they was of danny harold on his old pace? and a few riders on 20" montys. and since then the coverage has just got bigger and bigger with countless videos on youtube and manafacturers websites like Zoo, echo koxx whatever. But i suppose i would have found more if i knew what i was looking for which i didnt!

Local bike shops offer pretty much no support or coverage at all, unless tartys your local there is a much better and wider market for commuting, family cross country and road bikes so thats what they sell! my local place had a mission in thier window for about 2 years which never sold! But online retailers such as tarty and Dan Ko offer absoloutley superb support. They offer top quality parts with great service and reguarly host videos of thier sponsered riders which makes you just want to get out and ride more!

Personaly i have no support from my family, and i dont expect any either! The General public see it as mindless vandilism and think that we are crazed hoodlims who is going to mug ay one and every one for thier benifits and whatever else they have in thier wallet and will quote gladdly call the 5-0 which are almost deffinately going to turn up! so there is no support from them! i am sure other people have support from thier families and i am sure this gives them some drive! I love riding with mates, as there are always some funny times when riding with them!

I would say 90% of trials riders want to make the sport bigger! riders always want to get thier genre of riding noticed and i dont think that there is anything diffrent when it comes to trials, the bigger it gets the more parts are avalible to buy, the more people there are progressing in the sport and there are more people to learn from so i think that riders ar very keen to help the sport progress because i sure do!

In general i think that the coverage of trials is pretty naff, I mean i dont read magazines anymore so i dont know if its getting any better or bigger but i am pretty much 100% certain that its not as big as downhill free ride ect. i think this is because not many oldies want to ride trials but they wouldnt mind getting on a road bike or doing a bit of cross country so this will always limit the development of trials because only the younguns seem to be intrested.

erm hope that answers some of your questions mate!

[t33zr]

i belive one of the reasons that trials has grown so quickly in UK is basically the street...

I dont think you could get better street (spots) in the whole world....

[spode@thinkbikes]

I know from my time in Cisco, there are plenty of spots to ride, and masses of concrete - so that's not the issue.

But in the UK, people living out in the sticks often given up because there isn't anyone to go riding with. In the US - I imagine it's even worse. Generally, a rider has at least one other rider to go riding with, so that they stay in the sport. Maybe that's the issue in the US - population density. Once enough people are into the sport, it'll hit critical mass and kick off. So I guess it needs some promotion to get people interested

[MikeCottTrials]

I know from my time in Cisco, there are plenty of spots to ride, and masses of concrete - so that's not the issue.

But in the UK, people living out in the sticks often given up because there isn't anyone to go riding with. In the US - I imagine it's even worse. Generally, a rider has at least one other rider to go riding with, so that they stay in the sport. Maybe that's the issue in the US - population density. Once enough people are into the sport, it'll hit critical mass and kick off. So I guess it needs some promotion to get people interested

on the head

[nek0]

Thanks for all the replies!

Personally from what I've experienced people take trials as somewhat interesting and at the same time dangerous sport. There's a mixture of people that are interested, not know where to start and enough riders to really influence other riders especially anyone into biking.

I'm surprised to hear you guys don't have a lot of LBS support as it sounds like UK has a lot of comps and events that LBS could also benefit by helping out.

Many of the biking organization pretty much threw out trials. Granted, if you don't understand the sport watching comps could be boring to many while for many of us it's an inspiration. I'm just trying to find out what's working and how the US can see some more growth.

There are a lot of talks about sponsoring comps and getting more regional events going but I think the country needs to start small with local demo's, support from the bike shops and using people that's already into biking become more interested in the sport even if they don't ride trials full time.

If anyone else has a feedback please fell free to reply

[maxwellduryea]

So the US just doesnt count? How do you figure? Thats not fair to say...

Lance Trappe, Jeff Lenosky, Aaron Chase, Ryan Leech, Dylan Korba, etc..and so on have all progressed this sport. Furthermore, think about all the incredible DJ/Street riders....Not to mention the HUGE bmx scene in the US where most of the style and creativity of trials here in the UK is stolen....

granted, there is a tiny population of riders in the US. This is true. In Albuquerque there might be twenty people that have trials bikes, ten more with hardtails that do some trials "moves" on them, and then maybe ten more that have bikes and never use em. Three years ago there were five of us...altogether....

To say that the US only started liking cycling after Lance won the Tour is a bit rude. We have tons of excellent riders, in all genres. Please do your research before you make an ass of yourself.

People in the US tend to ride a lot more BMX/Park and general mountain biking. Trials hasnt taken off just yet, but it is slowly making its debut. Since moving from Albs, i have realized how large the trials population is here. Also what might be noteworthy is that there is a large distinction between trials and street. Back home most of the riders have bikes setup with proper saddles and suspension forks, and gears. Much like Ryan Leech rocks his bike. No one here in the UK does that. All are pure trials frames and parts. Which is interesting. We ride our bikes everywhere, we ride anything, and we do it all on one bike. I have just recently gotten a mod bike and look forward to riding pure trials for a while. Im not sure if i hope it grows, or if it slowly gains recognition. The way it is now, it allows for riders to join soley for enjoying the sport. I think if it grows too fast, we'll see too many riders in it for free bike parts/promotional reasons. Time will tell.

Do give it credit for the BMX influence and the riders that do help contribute to the broader aspect of cycling. Its not all about Lance in the States. Come to Albuquerque and then you can compare the two

[Alex Dark]

I know from my time in Cisco, there are plenty of spots to ride, and masses of concrete - so that's not the issue.

But in the UK, people living out in the sticks often given up because there isn't anyone to go riding with. In the US - I imagine it's even worse. Generally, a rider has at least one other rider to go riding with, so that they stay in the sport. Maybe that's the issue in the US - population density. Once enough people are into the sport, it'll hit critical mass and kick off. So I guess it needs some promotion to get people interested

I live out in the sticks ( 4 miles away from the nearest "settlement" ), and i ride in every saturday to catch the train in plymouth...

4 miles on a trials bike...no seat, 18:16 gearing, 2.4inch r.tyre

I must be mad ^

[Ben John-Hynes]

I live out in the sticks ( 4 miles away from the nearest "settlement" ), and i ride in every saturday to catch the train in plymouth...

4 miles on a trials bike...no seat, 18:16 gearing, 2.4inch r.tyre

I must be mad ^

Big girl's blouse!

[psycholist]

Isn't Albuquerque where Bugs Bunny keeps making wrong turns? ...

I reckon part of the reason trials is bigger in the UK is because there aren't a lot of BMX parks, so people who like more extreme riding and live in cities just ride on what they've got around them. Anyone who thinks trials is small in the US should try Ireland though. I know or know of possibly 8 trials riders in Ireland (And I got 3 of them into the sport) - that's 8 out of 4 million, so the sport is pretty obscure here. The only one who's really good moved here from Poland last year, where they have better facilities for trials riding... Come to think of it, if it wasn't for the internet I'd have no idea how big the sport is at all...

The good thing about the small numbers is that the cops have no idea what to do when they see me out hopping on stuff so they tend to just leave me at it. Part of this is that I tend to go pretty light on the bashguard, so I don't leave damage after me like a lot of BMXers/skaters and don't give security anywhere hassle if they do tell me to leave. I reckon though that security's issues with trials riders stem more from a general fear of any group of 'youths' collecting in public. I don't think I qualify as a youth any more at 28 though...

I still cycle mostly alone as nobody locally is anywhere near my (mediocre at best) level, so I spend group cycles showing people how to do things and teaching technique or suggesting ways to manage lines they're looking at using the ability they have. It's educational for both them and me, but doing that all the time won't get me fitter or better at trials.

Edited March 18, 2008 by psycholist

[JT!]

I went out riding with a couple of americans once, in that sence everything was the same. I think americans tend to ride more natural than we do here. There's more people out there riding shorter bikes with double discs than here.

I'm moving over there in a couple of months and i'll be taking my bike with me, so i might come bump this topic back up later.

[maxwellduryea]

I think trials will grow, but it has to have a solid foundation to build off of. Unlike so many other types of cycling, it needs a lot more time to mature. Take fixed gear riding; the popular craze here and back in the US. Its quite easy to get a bike, and then its quite easy to go riding with others. Trials is boring if you cant ride. Its boring getting to that point here you can actually backwheel things, its boring until you get ANY of the basic moves down. Which can take a while. This is why so many people get into it, give it a whirl, and then quit after a while. All other types of cycling are easy to progress in. Trials has to be the hardest and most frustrating. Any rider that has taken part in all the other genres, will agree. Its just frustrating. But when you get good and can loop moves together and just ride for fun, thats when others wanna get into the sport. Thats when people will commit. Thats why its hard in the US (and Ireland i suppose) because there is such a small amount of riders. Either way, i enjoy it more than any other riding i have taken part in. For physical, mental, and social piece of mind. I love it.

[Mike Poyzer @ Onza]

We have recently appointed a US distributor called J & B Importers. They area huge business over there but they are only gradually taking in the parts. They distribute to virtually every cycle shop in the US but do very small numbers with us at this stage. It is however the sort of company we have been looking for several years to take it on. If you want Tensile or Onza parts ask your local dealer and tell him he can source them from J and B. The more feedback that goes back that way the more they will begin to see it as potentially main stream. We are within a whisker of getting them to take complete bikes this year but they will need to be bought by the consumer. As somebody else said, you need to reach critical mass before it really takes off like the UK. And you need to get much broader availability of both bikes and parts.

Edited March 18, 2008 by Mike Poyzer @ Onza

[nek0]

So the US just doesnt count? How do you figure? Thats not fair to say...

Lance Trappe, Jeff Lenosky, Aaron Chase, Ryan Leech, Dylan Korba, etc..and so on have all progressed this sport. Furthermore, think about all the incredible DJ/Street riders....Not to mention the HUGE bmx scene in the US where most of the style and creativity of trials here in the UK is stolen....

granted, there is a tiny population of riders in the US. This is true. In Albuquerque there might be twenty people that have trials bikes, ten more with hardtails that do some trials "moves" on them, and then maybe ten more that have bikes and never use em. Three years ago there were five of us...altogether....

To say that the US only started liking cycling after Lance won the Tour is a bit rude. We have tons of excellent riders, in all genres. Please do your research before you make an ass of yourself.

People in the US tend to ride a lot more BMX/Park and general mountain biking. Trials hasnt taken off just yet, but it is slowly making its debut. Since moving from Albs, i have realized how large the trials population is here. Also what might be noteworthy is that there is a large distinction between trials and street. Back home most of the riders have bikes setup with proper saddles and suspension forks, and gears. Much like Ryan Leech rocks his bike. No one here in the UK does that. All are pure trials frames and parts. Which is interesting. We ride our bikes everywhere, we ride anything, and we do it all on one bike. I have just recently gotten a mod bike and look forward to riding pure trials for a while. Im not sure if i hope it grows, or if it slowly gains recognition. The way it is now, it allows for riders to join soley for enjoying the sport. I think if it grows too fast, we'll see too many riders in it for free bike parts/promotional reasons. Time will tell.

Do give it credit for the BMX influence and the riders that do help contribute to the broader aspect of cycling. Its not all about Lance in the States. Come to Albuquerque and then you can compare the two

I never said it didn't count or consider some of the riders. You have to admit, the scene in general especially the support by any cycling organization and the growth of the sport has been very slow. Many top riders have either moved onto other sports while we have so many talented riders at young age that could change that.

This thread is about how to make the trials scene bigger in the country (as well as others) and find out how other countries like UK and many others in Europe that are seeing success with the sport. So please don't assume I'm bashing the scene in general but rather help to grow the sport.

[steve@banbury-trials]

really interesting topic ,nice to read something a bit different on the froum by the way ,all my views have been mentioned.

4 miles on a trials bike...no seat, 18:16 gearing, 2.4inch r.tyre

I must be mad ^

lol ,last summer i did 10miles on mine ,that really buggered me up i was knackered .

steve

[F-Stop Junkie]

For many years trials riders were very limited, and always compared to Hans Rey as he had videos, Bula hats and a purple Zaskar. That all changed in May 1994 when 'Martin' Ashton and Martin Hawyes had a multipage spread in MBUK on a pair of Specialized Rockhoppers. What followed was really an explosion in trials coverage. Instead of pouring over a couple of pages on Libor Karas in MBi or an odd feature in MTB Pro, we suddenly had a lot of coverage in MBUK and that launched trials.

A lot of people don't realise just how much of an influence MBUK had in the pre-Internet days. When they featured Club Roost bars on riders bikes, everyone went out and bought them. When MBUK shifted it's focus towards what's now 'freeriding' and they started pushing longer forks and fatter tyres, that's what bikes looked like suddenly. The Malverns festival was just that.

As the Martins progressed, riding over Steve Behr's grannie's house I think, then into videos and so on, more riders got more and more coverage. MBUK even toured trials with the Urban Tour in 99 and 2000! On top of this trials was really centre stage from Bike 2006 onwards when Martin and Martyn had a series of concrete pipes to take them from the floor of Olympia to the upper level. It also launched a number of riders, as well as giving multi-page spreads to those who no longer ride...

At the same time the rise of the Internet - modandstocktrialsriding, bashguard.com, Section7.co.uk, trialskings.com - put more information to the riders and spread the word about events, components and stockists. '99 also saw the start of HipHop in MBUK, a regular double page news spread covering events, riders and in-depth information.

A number of bike shops got burned during this time, buying in parts which never sold.

MBUK refocussed, trials coverage dropped, and the hardcore of riders left supported the trials stockists and increasingly specific frames and components supplied direct to riders cut out the local bike shop for 90% of trials components. X-Street came and went, Trialsin.com got replaced by local equivalents, and finally specialist dealers came in to fill the gap.

As the media coverage dropped - though not disappeared - the resulting Internet communities have fed off themselves though a mix of rumour, misinformaton, and misplaced enthusiasm. This growing community has also helped build a number of trials companies upto the level they're at now.

[steve@banbury-trials]

wow ,you know your trials

[mr_malcolm]

just a not to say this must be one of the best topics i have ever read on here.

its really interesting.

good post

[maxwellduryea]

ill agree with that.

[F-Stop Junkie]

wow ,you know your trials

Know it? I lived it...

[Jonny Jones]

For many years trials riders were very limited, and always compared to Hans Rey as he had videos, Bula hats and a purple Zaskar. That all changed in May 1994 when 'Martin' Ashton and Martin Hawyes had a multipage spread in MBUK on a pair of Specialized Rockhoppers. What followed was really an explosion in trials coverage. Instead of pouring over a couple of pages on Libor Karas in MBi or an odd feature in MTB Pro, we suddenly had a lot of coverage in MBUK and that launched trials.

A lot of people don't realise just how much of an influence MBUK had in the pre-Internet days. When they featured Club Roost bars on riders bikes, everyone went out and bought them. When MBUK shifted it's focus towards what's now 'freeriding' and they started pushing longer forks and fatter tyres, that's what bikes looked like suddenly. The Malverns festival was just that.

As the Martins progressed, riding over Steve Behr's grannie's house I think, then into videos and so on, more riders got more and more coverage. MBUK even toured trials with the Urban Tour in 99 and 2000! On top of this trials was really centre stage from Bike 2006 onwards when Martin and Martyn had a series of concrete pipes to take them from the floor of Olympia to the upper level. It also launched a number of riders, as well as giving multi-page spreads to those who no longer ride...

At the same time the rise of the Internet - modandstocktrialsriding, bashguard.com, Section7.co.uk, trialskings.com - put more information to the riders and spread the word about events, components and stockists. '99 also saw the start of HipHop in MBUK, a regular double page news spread covering events, riders and in-depth information.

A number of bike shops got burned during this time, buying in parts which never sold.

MBUK refocussed, trials coverage dropped, and the hardcore of riders left supported the trials stockists and increasingly specific frames and components supplied direct to riders cut out the local bike shop for 90% of trials components. X-Street came and went, Trialsin.com got replaced by local equivalents, and finally specialist dealers came in to fill the gap.

As the media coverage dropped - though not disappeared - the resulting Internet communities have fed off themselves though a mix of rumour, misinformaton, and misplaced enthusiasm. This growing community has also helped build a number of trials companies upto the level they're at now.

Superb dude! :bow:

[Phil H]

Know it? I lived it...

I would have loved you to say:

'Know it? I AM Trials

Edited March 23, 2008 by Phil H

[nek0]

For many years trials riders were very limited, and always compared to Hans Rey as he had videos, Bula hats and a purple Zaskar. That all changed in May 1994 when 'Martin' Ashton and Martin Hawyes had a multipage spread in MBUK on a pair of Specialized Rockhoppers. What followed was really an explosion in trials coverage. Instead of pouring over a couple of pages on Libor Karas in MBi or an odd feature in MTB Pro, we suddenly had a lot of coverage in MBUK and that launched trials.

A lot of people don't realise just how much of an influence MBUK had in the pre-Internet days. When they featured Club Roost bars on riders bikes, everyone went out and bought them. When MBUK shifted it's focus towards what's now 'freeriding' and they started pushing longer forks and fatter tyres, that's what bikes looked like suddenly. The Malverns festival was just that.

As the Martins progressed, riding over Steve Behr's grannie's house I think, then into videos and so on, more riders got more and more coverage. MBUK even toured trials with the Urban Tour in 99 and 2000! On top of this trials was really centre stage from Bike 2006 onwards when Martin and Martyn had a series of concrete pipes to take them from the floor of Olympia to the upper level. It also launched a number of riders, as well as giving multi-page spreads to those who no longer ride...

At the same time the rise of the Internet - modandstocktrialsriding, bashguard.com, Section7.co.uk, trialskings.com - put more information to the riders and spread the word about events, components and stockists. '99 also saw the start of HipHop in MBUK, a regular double page news spread covering events, riders and in-depth information.

A number of bike shops got burned during this time, buying in parts which never sold.

MBUK refocussed, trials coverage dropped, and the hardcore of riders left supported the trials stockists and increasingly specific frames and components supplied direct to riders cut out the local bike shop for 90% of trials components. X-Street came and went, Trialsin.com got replaced by local equivalents, and finally specialist dealers came in to fill the gap.

As the media coverage dropped - though not disappeared - the resulting Internet communities have fed off themselves though a mix of rumour, misinformaton, and misplaced enthusiasm. This growing community has also helped build a number of trials companies upto the level they're at now.

Wow great stuff! It's very interesting to see how it evolved!

Internet is a great weapon in spreading the sport. It's definitely hard in a country (here) where the land is so massive and to find a local rider is sometimes not easy. With more local bike shop's support as well as some media/publication coverage on the sport I'm sure things can change in this country. I think for now, local & regional comps as well as demo's and trying to get involved with the bike industry like expo's is a great way to start. Mike Steidley is actually going to be at one of the major bike expo next weekend so I'm hoping to check it out, meet with him and have a chat as he's definitely one of well known rider's in the US as well as in the biking industry.

[F-Stop Junkie]

Imagine if Bike magazine had cover to cover trials coverage, instead of the occasional half page in Dirt Rag. Of course more people would get into trials. At the same time though, you need riders (or companies who promote riders) who are clever and keen enough to promote themselves. Hans Rey is the perfect example of this. You need riders who are out there, supported by media (online, print, video...) who can reinforce the trials message to the public. This is doubley difficult in the US, where a lot of the big magazines demand advertising spend before they'll feature your products.

Trials is a very small sport. Cannondale never put a specific trials frame into production because the costs of machine testing and certification, design, production and distribution couldn't be recovered through the number of frames they expected to sell. This probably tells you something about how many of each model they expect to sell, and the lifespan of the frame.

The other problem with Internet forums is that fashions can turn very quickly. Imagine all the shops buying in cheap, short cage road mechs to sell to trials riders when they all suddenly want specific tensioners?

Plus a lot of trials suppliers are smaller companies who don't operate through the big suppliers and wholesalers most shops use. As a result, Mr Shopkeeper has to contact a number of small companies, set up accounts, pay bills up front... Do many want that hassle for the sake of a couple of riders spending a couple of hundred quid? Also how many bike shops have the knowledge to support trials riders properly? Not many, unless they have a bouncing spanner monkey out back...

The Internet has really helped keep trials alive. I remember pouring over the latest photocopied Essex Club newsletter to fall on my door step, and now I can get trials news updated 24 hours a day from all over the world. It's now easier than ever to find other riders, talk trials and go out on rides. That's A Good Thing.

I would have loved you to say:

'Know it? I AM Trials

I WAS trials doesn't quite have the same ring to it

Plus, there are many who have made a much bigger contribution to trials than I ever could...

[Mark W]

Trials may be bigger, but it's in a far worse state than it used to be.