Matthew62 Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 I think it's very, very different to WBH and at first i compared the two but i don't think it's at all fair to do so. They are miles apart in intent, ethos and style but i can see how an initial comparison would be made. Obviously the positives to the film have been covered many times so i won't restate the obvious but having watched it many times and having had really mixed feelings towards it i've kinda narrowed it down to one criticism, which of course is my own so could be way off the mark. For a video that is all about multiple riders, different locations, friends (as the label read) and being together for me the video lacked a real sense of camaraderie If it was to be a lifestyle video i'm surprised there were no shots to reflect this, or as i recall not a single shot of riders together, always one line at a time. I just found that a slightly mixed message to the one portrayed by the Clean blog... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Clayton Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Awwww was proper getting my hopes up for a proper trials video then! turn out it was just people on over sized BMX's Not my cup of tea! But well done well put together from what i watched anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted April 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 For a video that is all about multiple riders, different locations, friends (as the label read) and being together for me the video lacked a real sense of camaraderie If it was to be a lifestyle video i'm surprised there were no shots to reflect this, or as i recall not a single shot of riders together, always one line at a time. I just found that a slightly mixed message to the one portrayed by the Clean blog... I find it sort of interesting you found that, 'cos I tried to show the 'togetherness' side of things. There were a couple of direct references to that at the start of the 2nd section with everyone at a spot together, and everyone rolling about the place. There are also a few clips where you can hear people cheering in the background. There are also a couple of lurkers in there too, although for the most part everyone seemed to naturally move out of shot. Quite a few times when I was filming people would ask if they were in shot or not - I don't particularly mind either way, although I know some filmers/viewers can be pretty strict about lurkers appearing in shot. But yeah, like I said, it's interesting it came across that way to you. Quite a few times though it was also just me and one rider. There were a couple of rides where it was pretty much just me and, say, Ali or Joel. Awwww was proper getting my hopes up for a proper trials video then! Surely the names of the riders involved and the first 30secs should've given that away? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Clayton Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 I find it sort of interesting you found that, 'cos I tried to show the 'togetherness' side of things. There were a couple of direct references to that at the start of the 2nd section with everyone at a spot together, and everyone rolling about the place. There are also a few clips where you can hear people cheering in the background. There are also a couple of lurkers in there too, although for the most part everyone seemed to naturally move out of shot. Quite a few times when I was filming people would ask if they were in shot or not - I don't particularly mind either way, although I know some filmers/viewers can be pretty strict about lurkers appearing in shot. But yeah, like I said, it's interesting it came across that way to you. Quite a few times though it was also just me and one rider. There were a couple of rides where it was pretty much just me and, say, Ali or Joel. Surely the names of the riders involved and the first 30secs should've given that away? no not really haha... i dont tend to take notice of names and stuff! just the riding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew62 Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Having re-watched it i can see there is the odd shot with a couple of people in and i really like when that occurs as it appears to be what the video and Clean itself is all about. I guess i would have liked to have seen much more of it to a greater extent to emphasize the point. I mean real interaction between the riders, perhaps some short conversations, the odd pat on the back - nothing cheesy just to see some actual warmth towards one another. Of course i know none of the riders personally so they may all well be insular characters, but i personally enjoy Sam's clips the most as his disposition really reflects in the film and he almost appears (with Joel) to be the only ones happy to be there. The reason i mentioned it was in your response to JD you mentioned that there's a great street scene in the UK and it appears as though many people are unaware of it and i wanted to ask you as someone clearly within the scene why you think it isn't more popular or well acknowledged? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 "I'm not that grumpy!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted April 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Having re-watched it i can see there is the odd shot with a couple of people in and i really like when that occurs as it appears to be what the video and Clean itself is all about. I guess i would have liked to have seen much more of it to a greater extent to emphasize the point. I mean real interaction between the riders, perhaps some short conversations, the odd pat on the back - nothing cheesy just to see some actual warmth towards one another. Of course i know none of the riders personally so they may all well be insular characters, but i personally enjoy Sam's clips the most as his disposition really reflects in the film and he almost appears (with Joel) to be the only ones happy to be there. The reason i mentioned it was in your response to JD you mentioned that there's a great street scene in the UK and it appears as though many people are unaware of it and i wanted to ask you as someone clearly within the scene why you think it isn't more popular or well acknowledged? Yeah, I sorta see what you're getting at. Sam and Joel are just generally happy the whole time though, so it's not too surprising that comes across on film. Not to say that Ali and Ben are sourpusses the whole time, but basically if you've met Sam and Joel you'll be well aware of what they're like I think the reason that it's not really as well known is possibly due to the fact that it's basically just more underground, and a lot of the time people just ride to ride rather than trying to go out specifically to film. From videos that people like Joel and Ben make, it seems like a lot more time and care is spent over them compared to the slew of 'normal' trials videos that pop up pretty much every week. There's just less people doing it so there's less chance of exposure I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew62 Posted April 18, 2011 Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 Yeah i personally like to see riders enjoy what they're doing in whatever form that may be. Yeah i guess those within the underground scene as you say need to possibly promote it to others to increase the growth of it. In order for it to grow i think it needs to be very open as i truly believe there are a wealth of riders looking for this type of release. I think there's a risk with anything 'underground' as it can end up being elitist and cliquey when it inevitably gains momentum as often the appeal and importance of being underground overshadows the original intent of the group/movement/style etc. I think Joel in partciular has a lovely way of capturing these elements in his videos, and they seem pretty damn well shot also. Some of his London videos seem to really make a good point of how good riding can be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted April 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2011 I'm not saying that everyone else riding needs to promote it more because they don't, really. I think for the most part (and one of the things I find refreshing about riding with everyone who was in that video compared to my day-to-day life of working in a trials shop) everyone involved just likes riding, and just wants to ride. It's not really about anything else. From speaking to Joel I know he likes having videos out simply because it's good to look back on. I've never had that opportunity before so I've got about 10 years of my riding life that's totally undocumented, and having been at Joel's flat while he was watching old videos I can see how it'd be nice to have that to look back on. But yeah, I don't think it really needs promoting. It's not like the age-old "How can we make trials more popular?" shit that everyone seems to go on about - as it is, the people and companies involved are all pretty passionate about it and give a shit, and that's cool. That's what I'm trying to show more rather than trying to put any sort of ideal across or anything like that. I'm not trying to represent anyone in this, I'm just putting it across how I see it. Just a difference in methods I guess. Like Jack coming along and filming some of the lines Ali and I were getting in Bristol, then putting it up online instantly - Jack obviously felt the best way to show it to the world was to just put a little quality mobile clip up online asap, I wanted to try and build it up a bit and do it in a different way. One way's not 'right' compared to the other or anything, it's just different. I know it sounds like I'm a total pussy but all I really wanted to do was to make people want to ride, or think about riding in a different light. It seems to have done that, so that's cool - I've seen a few posts/comments on different places online where people have said they had to go riding after watching it and that's all I wanted to do. There's not really much more of a hidden agenda EDIT: I don't know if it'd really end up being that cliquey either as all the people I've met out riding have been super open and friendly about it all. I suppose there's a bit of "Us versus them" online, but you don't really often see people like Ben, Joel, Sam or Rowan getting involved in that sort of thing, which is why I wanted to film them really. I guess the image I've given it from this video puts it out there in a certain way, but I'm just one person and not really representative of the whole street scene... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skoze Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Just watching it again for some pre-ride motivation - something i mised the other times; PHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD™ Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Just watching it again for some pre-ride motivation - something i mised the other times; PHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL Took me until the 2nd watch to realise Danny was in it, let alone anyone else. It's that black & white doing its thing again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted April 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Yeah man, Phil came out for a ride on the wrong bike one time when we were out in London. Hadn't seen him for years, was good to catch up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rago muffin Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Yeah man, Phil came out for a ride on the wrong bike one time when we were out in London. Hadn't seen him for years, was good to catch up! whose phil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaotic3vil Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 Great video!! Ali is getting better on creativeness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rago muffin Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 whose phil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolver Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 Phil.... Feeney? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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