£30 Fine, Cpo Riding Path *video Evidence*

[Mr Plod]

They can legally detain you for 30 minutes, but they'd have to do that physically if you wanted to ride off, which is unlikely seeing as they're largely under-trained, mindless f**ktards, from my experiences in London.

Sorry but being a PCSO myself with the Metropolitan Police I resent that comment. I'm currently doing my training at Hendon and it's an excellent course. Granted the training may be a little too short at only 6 weeks but most of the job is just Common Sense. Most of the PCSO's I've met when riding or just generally out on the street have been excellent... I'm not just saying that because I'm in the job myself but I feel we do a great job and like I said in the topic in NMC, we don't have to fine you and the chances are if it's the first time we've seen you riding on the pavement then we'll just ask you to get off and walk but if you've been warned before and you're seen on the pavement again on a number of occasions then it's obvious you haven't listened to us and so you deserve the fine... (Not that this is aimed at anyone in particular but if you've been warned before and persist in breaking the law, because that is what you infact are doing, then you deserve the fine...)

Correct with the 30 minute thing though... and if you do walk off then we're told to leave you to it but we'll more than likely put your name out and so when you're next spotted, you'll more than likely be asked to account for yourself and just generally causing you a problem as you've caused us problems before...

I get slips so i rip them up... lol

then they cannot fine you

I haven't covered fixed penalty notices yet (the fines you get), but I'm pretty sure they're the same type of form as a Stop and Account (Which I have covered in training). Therefore when writing the fine it produces two copies, one of which we keep and then file and the other which is pretty much a receipt for yourself. So we can fine you as it is put onto the system and if you fail to pay the fine then it'll keep rising until you do pay or you get summoned to court (I think but I'll update this once we cover the topic in training).

Providing us with a false name will just give us a quality reason to do a Name check on you so you might as well just be straight with us from the start... If we keep seeing you riding on the pavement then we'll just put your name and profile onto our system we have alerting all the other local officers that if they see you riding on the pavement then you've been warned before several times and to just dish out the fine straight away (Probably why the officers you're dealing with just dish out a fine straight away as you've been warned by other officers countless times before)...

And just to add... In the Met and possibly other forces, We now have the power to stop you whilst you're riding. Might be worth thinking about in future when you're riding off as we do have the power to stop you now.

Thanks

[Mat Smith!]

Common myth, from what I can tell. I think it's just seat-tube size, i.e. if your seat-tube is under a certain size (think it's 12"?) you can ride on it, as you're probably a child riding a child's bike.

However, generally, the police - who are probably gonna be f**ked off with the situation anyway if they're fining you - are more likely to get pissed off by some know-it-all trials rider who starts quoting effective seat-tube lengths at them, so just try and keep them sweet and they'll often let you off.

Plus they write them on carbon paper, so it's irrelevant.

There's a difference between a Section44 (Stop and Search form) and an actual fine. If you get fined, you get fined. If you get a S+S, you haven't been given a fine.

no offence, but your such a geek .

Is is the seattube thingy? or the wheels? cos ive always been told its the wheels...

just for next time i get stopped .

Matx

[Conor the basher.]

Sorry but being a PCSO myself with the Metropolitan Police I resent that comment. I'm currently doing my training at Hendon and it's an excellent course. Granted the training may be a little too short at only 6 weeks but most of the job is just Common Sense. Most of the PCSO's I've met when riding or just generally out on the street have been excellent... I'm not just saying that because I'm in the job myself but I feel we do a great job and like I said in the topic in NMC, we don't have to fine you and the chances are if it's the first time we've seen you riding on the pavement then we'll just ask you to get off and walk but if you've been warned before and you're seen on the pavement again on a number of occasions then it's obvious you haven't listened to us and so you deserve the fine... (Not that this is aimed at anyone in particular but if you've been warned before and persist in breaking the law, because that is what you infact are doing, then you deserve the fine...)

Correct with the 30 minute thing though... and if you do walk off then we're told to leave you to it but we'll more than likely put your name out and so when you're next spotted, you'll more than likely be asked to account for yourself and just generally causing you a problem as you've caused us problems before...

I haven't covered fixed penalty notices yet (the fines you get), but I'm pretty sure they're the same type of form as a Stop and Account (Which I have covered in training). Therefore when writing the fine it produces two copies, one of which we keep and then file and the other which is pretty much a receipt for yourself. So we can fine you as it is put onto the system and if you fail to pay the fine then it'll keep rising until you do pay or you get summoned to court (I think but I'll update this once we cover the topic in training).

Providing us with a false name will just give us a quality reason to do a Name check on you so you might as well just be straight with us from the start... If we keep seeing you riding on the pavement then we'll just put your name and profile onto our system we have alerting all the other local officers that if they see you riding on the pavement then you've been warned before several times and to just dish out the fine straight away (Probably why the officers you're dealing with just dish out a fine straight away as you've been warned by other officers countless times before)...

And just to add... In the Met and possibly other forces, We now have the power to stop you whilst you're riding. Might be worth thinking about in future when you're riding off as we do have the power to stop you now.

Thanks

psco's are Fooking pricks in not lieing, they think they are above us becuase they have a coat on saying sumat to do with the police yeah right. get a real job

As for the fine you shouldent have been riding ont the pavment Really Just pay up and dont do it again

[Mark W]

Sorry but being a PCSO myself with the Metropolitan Police I resent that comment. I'm currently doing my training at Hendon and it's an excellent course. Granted the training may be a little too short at only 6 weeks but most of the job is just Common Sense. Most of the PCSO's I've met when riding or just generally out on the street have been excellent... I'm not just saying that because I'm in the job myself but I feel we do a great job and like I said in the topic in NMC.

Cool. That's your opinion. Mine is that I'd prefer to have real police officers around who are more enabled to enforce the law. The vast, vast majority of PCSOs I've met have been twats, and that's not because they've had a go at me or anything like that, they just seem to be dicks. At Southbank we get them coming past all the time, attempting to be 'funny', giving us grief for riding Southbank and stuff like that - almost the entire male side of my family are in the Police, so I'm not some normal TF kid just getting mardy at "Authority" or whatever, I just genuinely haven't ever really felt like my Community has been Supported by any of the PCSOs.

I'd argue that 6 weeks really isn't long enough at all, bearing in the mind the pitiful grasp of the law some of the PCSOs I've dealt with have had. Asking me if I have a 'license' for shooting photographs in public places? What? It's total bollocks. The actions of the PCSOs in this video pretty accurately sum up how well most of the PCSOs I've had to put up with have dealt with various situations they've felt the need to talk to me in. Whether it's having no idea about the law, possessing no social skills, pretending to have more powers than they actually have, whatever - I have never seen them doing anything useful. Every time I've seen any PCSOs try and disrupt some "Anti-social youths" - the very reason they were created - they've failed miserably, simply because everyone knows they have no power whatsoever. No power = no respect, that's just the way it is.

Sorry to be shit-talking your job and all that, but I just really, really don't agree with the way the government have introduced PCSOs. Just like ASBOs, they're useless.

I'm sure you'll do your job well, but unfortunately, you're one potentially decent officer out of many abject failures. This isn't anything personal at you, so don't take it that way.

no offence, but your such a geek .

Is is the seattube thingy? or the wheels? cos ive always been told its the wheels...

just for next time i get stopped .

Matx

I'd rather know stuff than not know stuff.

[Alex.loves.boys]

psco's are Fooking pricks in not lieing, they think they are above us becuase they have a coat on saying sumat to do with the police yeah right. get a real job

As for the fine you shouldent have been riding ont the pavment Really Just pay up and dont do it again

I'm sorry but what do you do for a living

some of the ones uve encouterd might of been pricks but how is it not a dcent job?

[Conor the basher.]

I'm sorry but what do you do for a living

some of the ones uve encouterd might of been pricks but how is it not a dcent job?

Why on earth would you want to walk around pretending to be a police officer but having no power over anyone ? everytime anything happens you have to get real police to come in ? pointless i dont care what anyone says i think its a pointless job.

[Bearded Midget]

You must have had a warning before they dont just give you the fine, you get a warning !

ive lost count how many warnings weve had, glad i wasnt around when they got the fines, i had a puncture, for once a puncture was a good thing.

edit: for those who are arguing bout pcsos having stupid jobs etc...

well basically pcso's are a real police man, but you have to consider they have small penis's therefore no power. argument solved!

Edited March 28, 2008 by Bearded Midget

[Mark W]

Oh, forgot to mention how awesome it is having some older PCSO try and "Exercise some power" when he's trying to show the newbie the ropes. £30 fine for riding in my friend's drive, then trying to start a fight with my friend? Not going to happen, Mr. Older Man...

[Mr Plod]

psco's are Fooking pricks in not lieing, they think they are above us becuase they have a coat on saying sumat to do with the police yeah right. get a real job

HA! Sorry but it is a real job... You might have encountered a few that are 'on their high horse' but almost all the PCSO's around here aren't like that...

Cool. That's your opinion. Mine is that I'd prefer to have real police officers around who are more enabled to enforce the law. The vast, vast majority of PCSOs I've met have been twats, and that's not because they've had a go at me or anything like that, they just seem to be dicks. At Southbank we get them coming past all the time, attempting to be 'funny', giving us grief for riding Southbank and stuff like that - almost the entire male side of my family are in the Police, so I'm not some normal TF kid just getting mardy at "Authority" or whatever, I just genuinely haven't ever really felt like my Community has been Supported by any of the PCSOs.

I'd argue that 6 weeks really isn't long enough at all, bearing in the mind the pitiful grasp of the law some of the PCSOs I've dealt with have had. Asking me if I have a 'license' for shooting photographs in public places? What? It's total bollocks. The actions of the PCSOs in this video pretty accurately sum up how well most of the PCSOs I've had to put up with have dealt with various situations they've felt the need to talk to me in. Whether it's having no idea about the law, possessing no social skills, pretending to have more powers than they actually have, whatever - I have never seen them doing anything useful. Every time I've seen any PCSOs try and disrupt some "Anti-social youths" - the very reason they were created - they've failed miserably, simply because everyone knows they have no power whatsoever. No power = no respect, that's just the way it is.

Sorry to be shit-talking your job and all that, but I just really, really don't agree with the way the government have introduced PCSOs. Just like ASBOs, they're useless.

I'm sure you'll do your job well, but unfortunately, you're one potentially decent officer out of many abject failures. This isn't anything personal at you, so don't take it that way.

I'd rather know stuff than not know stuff.

I believe PCSO's were brought about because of the high risk of terrorism (brought in after September 11th...) and you'll find most our powers come under the terrorist act e.g. we can maintain a cordon because of a terrorist incident but you'll find we're used to man cordons for any incident which strictly speaking, we shouldn't be...

Yes granted we're all entitled to our own opinions and I'll agree with you on some points, e.g. Inner City Boroughs like Westminster and so on aren't really a place where a PCSO should be imo. When I went for my induction day we was told that anyone who's a PCSO in boroughs like Westminster will just be like tour guides in the sense that they don't have real crime to deal with and all they're doing is giving directions to tourists which is true. Inner City boroughs are mainly businesses and so on compared to the suburbs like Waltham Forest, Hackney, Tower Hamlets and so on which are mainly populated by houses and areas for living in (I guess what I'm saying is, inner city is for working in more than living in and the suburbs are for living in more than working). So PCSOs aren't actually benefiting a community inner city because there isn't really one...

I'm working in the suburbs (I won't say where because I don't particularly want to and I'm advised not to) and my beat is of a highly populated area and contains a number of schools and my main role is to build a rapore (sp?) with the public to which they can then feel trust towards me and provide me with information of any criminal activity in the area e.g. drug dealing and so on. The reason being is that I'll then write the information down in my pocket notebook and go back to the station and right a report up on the system. Little snippets of information will then be added when given to an officer and it'll build up a profile to which if serious enough, will be flagged and reviewed by senior officers and then action taken if required. Alot of the drugs raids that happen now and that raid yesterday involving 600 officers (which was in the papers yesterday...) all start with PCSO's gathering intel from the community and building up a profile which then provides a case and a reason for the raids...

So I guess what I'm trying to say is we do make a difference, but as I said earlier, not inner city as communities are few and far between.

Hope I've made sense and if not then highlight the areas you'd like me to explain about.

Cheers

[Mark W]

Fair enough. I always thought that they were to do with anti-social behaviour and stuff because of the name - you're not really 'supporting the community' by infringing upon civil rights in the name of 'terrorism'. Again, that's not a dig at PCSOs, it's more the government's way of dicking the UK about with their terrorism laws.

But yeah, I see what you mean I suppose. I just don't understand their presence in the central London, where there's already the Met and the City of London (Don't get me started...) Police trying to uphold the law, albeit badly. PCSOs are totally useless there, and as you've seen with me, do more harm than good for the reputation of the police as a whole.

Hopefully you didn't take what I was saying personally, anyway.

[Synergy]

I LOVE PCSO's

2 of my mates are them and they do a f**king good job, people moan at them because they dnt like them but i have a lot of respect there doing there job even if it anoyes us (although majority of time its our fault and we are in wrong )

[Mr Plod]

Fair enough. I always thought that they were to do with anti-social behaviour and stuff because of the name - you're not really 'supporting the community' by infringing upon civil rights in the name of 'terrorism'. Again, that's not a dig at PCSOs, it's more the government's way of dicking the UK about with their terrorism laws.

But yeah, I see what you mean I suppose. I just don't understand their presence in the central London, where there's already the Met and the City of London (Don't get me started...) Police trying to uphold the law, albeit badly. PCSOs are totally useless there, and as you've seen with me, do more harm than good for the reputation of the police as a whole.

Hopefully you didn't take what I was saying personally, anyway.

I agree with you and the inner city policing (like I said in my previous post) PCSO's should only really be deployed in the suburbs and where there are highly populated areas (for living not working). Although the British Transport Police PCSO's are excellent and I can't fault what they do in anyway.

Everyone obviously remembers 7/7, but PCSO's played a major role in saving lives that day and even Police Officers said they couldn't have done it without our help....

What about the Tiger Tiger incident last year... The first on scene was a Sergeant and 5 of his PCSO's who evacuated the area and set up cordons and if the bomb had detonated, then they would have saved countless lives.

And of course the Terrorist raids in Forest Gate. Intel which was gathered by PCSO's

The fact is we are effective (Maybe no inner London) but certainly in outer London and that's not only intel gathering but just being a deterrent and being there for someone to talk to and express their concerns.

And I've taken it all to heart Mark!

[Mark W]

I'm still not sold on the 'deterrent' point. Maybe at first when people didn't recognise the uniform and thought it was the 'real' police, but now "Youths" are aware of the PCSO's uniform, I honestly don't see them as being much of a detterent, from what I've seen in the estate I live on, and in the estates I've seen them operating in in Hackney.

Fair play about the rest of it though, I guess...

[Mr Plod]

I'm still not sold on the 'deterrent' point. Maybe at first when people didn't recognise the uniform and thought it was the 'real' police, but now "Youths" are aware of the PCSO's uniform, I honestly don't see them as being much of a detterent, from what I've seen in the estate I live on, and in the estates I've seen them operating in in Hackney.

Fair play about the rest of it though, I guess...

Depends how PCSO's are used. Each Borough has its own way of policing...

I can see you're still not sold on the whole PCSO idea which is fair enough as everyone is entitled to their own views and opinions. Just I don't think it's very fair when people slag us off especially when they believe what they see in the papers (The Daily Mail hate us). When we do something 'wrong' it is plastered across a whole page but when we do something excellent like save someones life, we get minimal coverage e.g. a 2"x2" box...

[Alex.loves.boys]

Why on earth would you want to walk around pretending to be a police officer but having no power over anyone ? everytime anything happens you have to get real police to come in ? pointless i dont care what anyone says i think its a pointless job.

orite wel thats ur opion

but i like gyser

so i was sticking up for him

[Mr Plod]

orite wel thats ur opion

but i like gyser

so i was sticking up for him

Haha thanks. Much appreciated. Can handle myself though...

[Mark W]

Depends how PCSO's are used. Each Borough has its own way of policing...

I can see you're still not sold on the whole PCSO idea which is fair enough as everyone is entitled to their own views and opinions. Just I don't think it's very fair when people slag us off especially when they believe what they see in the papers (The Daily Mail hate us). When we do something 'wrong' it is plastered across a whole page but when we do something excellent like save someones life, we get minimal coverage e.g. a 2"x2" box...

I may have shit-talked your job, but you still had no right to call me a Daily Mail reader, haha.

[Peperami]

I kinda have doubts that you didn't give the PCSOs any shit too, having seen the list of people in the group. How you deal with them = how they deal with you.

Exactly what i was thinking. You probably got fined due to failing 'the attitude test' rather than for actually riding on the pavement. Man.

As with most situations in life, you get what you give.

[Dan Burgess]

Sorry but being a PCSO myself with the Metropolitan Police I resent that comment. I'm currently doing my training at Hendon and it's an excellent course. Granted the training may be a little too short at only 6 weeks but most of the job is just Common Sense. Most of the PCSO's I've met when riding or just generally out on the street have been excellent... I'm not just saying that because I'm in the job myself but I feel we do a great job and like I said in the topic in NMC, we don't have to fine you and the chances are if it's the first time we've seen you riding on the pavement then we'll just ask you to get off and walk but if you've been warned before and you're seen on the pavement again on a number of occasions then it's obvious you haven't listened to us and so you deserve the fine... (Not that this is aimed at anyone in particular but if you've been warned before and persist in breaking the law, because that is what you infact are doing, then you deserve the fine...)

Correct with the 30 minute thing though... and if you do walk off then we're told to leave you to it but we'll more than likely put your name out and so when you're next spotted, you'll more than likely be asked to account for yourself and just generally causing you a problem as you've caused us problems before...

I haven't covered fixed penalty notices yet (the fines you get), but I'm pretty sure they're the same type of form as a Stop and Account (Which I have covered in training). Therefore when writing the fine it produces two copies, one of which we keep and then file and the other which is pretty much a receipt for yourself. So we can fine you as it is put onto the system and if you fail to pay the fine then it'll keep rising until you do pay or you get summoned to court (I think but I'll update this once we cover the topic in training).

Providing us with a false name will just give us a quality reason to do a Name check on you so you might as well just be straight with us from the start... If we keep seeing you riding on the pavement then we'll just put your name and profile onto our system we have alerting all the other local officers that if they see you riding on the pavement then you've been warned before several times and to just dish out the fine straight away (Probably why the officers you're dealing with just dish out a fine straight away as you've been warned by other officers countless times before)...

And just to add... In the Met and possibly other forces, We now have the power to stop you whilst you're riding. Might be worth thinking about in future when you're riding off as we do have the power to stop you now.

Thanks

If you fine me you will get a backslap

[dan_addison]

psco's are Fooking pricks in not lieing, they think they are above us becuase they have a coat on saying sumat to do with the police yeah right. get a real job

I think you are lieing, I bet your just one of those 'hard' kids who when a copper or a PCSO tell's you to move on you strat shouting and balling trying to make your mate's laugh. Fact is like gyser said PCSO played a big help in the terroist attacks a couple of years ago. Also where i live a PCSO has made a difference, he may be a complete wanker but he's still doing a good job and inproving the area

[Skoze]

If you fine me you will get a backslap

Maybe it's that kind of attitude that got you your fines?

[BenLeacock™]

If you fine me you will get a backslap

your willing to slap a pcso but not willing to take some blue pallets You my friend are very weird !

[craigjames]

that video you posted mark is actually quite scary of how ignorant the people we put in charge to patrol and manage our streets CAN be. unfortunately its also the sort of thing ive seen when ive been approached by SOME pcso's. personally i dont think that its completely their faults, a lack of training and knowledge dont help, but it does seem that the majority of the pcso's ive come across do seem to be complete jobsworths and take the (lack of) power to the extreme. its a bit sad though.

on the other hand some pcso's ive met have been polite, helpful and empathetic towards me. its just a shame that the others spoil the image that pcso's have and the work that they do.

[Phil H]

PSCO's are police............. but cheaper. Everyone knows we need more police on the streets, however this would incur massive amounts of money being spent through training etc, tax payer's money. This is where PCSO's come in: a cheaper, easy, 'half hearted' alternative that create a shirade of government action.

It appears to me PCSO's serve no real purpose other than 'high visibility reassurance', their Job is certainly not to prevent crime or terrorism thus personally I'm not sure if this aim warrants money being poured in by the government atall. A couple of years back at School PSCO's walked around the playground, I'm not so sure this utter waste of time 'bridged gaps between groups in our community'. However I can atleast see it meant real policemen didn't waste their time.

At the end of the day this Government scheme may appear applaudable on paper, however in the real world has little use. I will use the analogy of a 'bully box'. If a school is having problem with bullying they may make a bully box, although this may never be used and may have no purpose, on paper it looks good because they have taken steps towards reducing the problem. This sums up my thoughts on PCSO's, a 'bright idea' that looks good but in the real world does not function well.

Finally, Gyser by the way you talk you clearly believe in what you are doing, which is very good and I'm convinced you will be a good PCSO, however I can't help but feeling maybe everything your saying has just been programmed into you in your training thus far, instilling the belief that you are serving a purpose to society as a whole, not just a government tool to look like they are taking action.

Well the above is just my thoughts, I mean no offence to anyone who is/was/will be a PCSO it's just what (from my limited knowledge on the matter) I think to be the case.

Phil

[monkeyseemonkeydo]

I believe PCSO's were brought about because of the high risk of terrorism (brought in after September 11th...)

Sorry, but that made me laugh. From what I understand, if any kind of threat or threatening behaviour is used either towards a PCSO or anyone else, the officer is trained to simply walk away. They aren't allowed to intervene (is that right Gyser?).

Also, completely agree that they are simply cheap, undertrained police officers with very little real power or authority. Somewhere above a security guard but far below a real police officer.

Sorry for more shit talking of your job but that's my opinion.