arw_86 Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 (edited) i saaaaay...believe what you want to believe and do what you want to do, but dont try and make others do the same.i personally dont believe in any gods and that religion was created as a way of controlling people. e.g- dont commit that crime otherwise you will go to hell and god will punish you etc, its just using the thought of a higher power to keep people in order. again this is what i believe and i wont try and persuade people to believe it to......we can all make our own minds up!"EDIT.......JT-My stance is people can what believe in what they want, but when it starts effecting me personally, that's when i start to have a problem." i guess i should of read this first. same thinking as me, sorry bud Edited May 21, 2009 by arw_86 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davetrials Posted May 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 ID like to thank JT for sending me that louise therox video.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2ZFR4DbC5o...&playnext=1Im off to kill some extreamists Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider Lad Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Christianity is such a 'watertight*' theory that its hard to argue with it.Arew you seroius?!!! Watertight? It's pissing allover the place like an incontinent 90 year old! Look at it's movement on moral stance through the ages. It changes it's stance on any issue according to the shifting moral zeitgeist. There's no real constant to it. It's just self-serving. Even the 'moderate' religious of any faith are contributing towards the permisive culture that allows fundamentalism to thrive. How anyone of 'faith' can claim to be a person of fact and reason is beyond me. How can the one most supposedly most important thing in some peoples lives be the only thing which they don't scrutinise in even the slightest bit of detail. It's some kind of subverted egotism, the need to feel that you're more special. Humans are masters at self delusion, it's a proven survival mechanism. The sooner people open themselves up to discovering the truth and facts that are out there the better. It's only ignorance that allows these ancient superstitions to survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simpson Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 (edited) I can't explain where the dust and gas came from that (I believe) built our Earth and universe, their explaination is that God put it there.I have faith but not christianity, I think that christianity is really unfairly portrayed in the media, 100%, I cant seem to watch any debate on the TV without some old christian there, professing that everyone is wrong and god told her to say this.... I think all thats bollocks, I go to a faith school and most of the people there are really nice and do a lot of work to help in the local community and think that can only be a good thing.Also the morals of the church is how I would like to live my life, not as black and white as the 10 commandmants, but I think its more guidelines. Edited May 22, 2009 by Simpson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endofreak Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 The Westboro Baptist Church have a few websites. Here's just one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 This thread hit a nerve with me, which is strange because usually I don't give a toss about things like this.Comparing the Westboro Baptist Church to that of active, honest Christians is not possible. They are an extremist group. That's like trying to compare the London bombers to be the true word of Islam.We live in a free world, people can believe what they want to - you choose not to believe, others choose to. This doesn't mean they're stupid or bad people. Perhaps it means that they're minds are a little more open than yours and like to believe in something more than what is visable.No matter what evidence is bought to light, no matter what you say, do or suggest to them won't make the slightest bit of difference - I'm sure they've heard anything you have to say a million times over.This isn't a dig at you, but I just don't understand what you're trying to achieve by this. I've read people saying 'I don't mind religion as long as it doesn't effect me' - thats fine; but I find it rather hypocritical that you want to denounce anyone with faith in anything of a greater power then ourselves.I'm not religious at all, but if other people want to be thats fine by me. I've debated with Christians before, however I've never once called their religion bullshit or anything like that.There are plenty of Christian forums out there, they will happily debate with you but I suggest you do your research first. If you're only ammo on them is 'it's all bollocks' they'll shoot you down in flames and you'll look rather stupid.Again, this isn't a dig at you. You seem like an intelligent enough guy, but I just don't understand what you're trying to achieve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 I just feel kind of sorry for 'true believers'. Although it's obviously good if they get something out of it I can't help thinking that 99.9% of people who are religious are so purely because it's what they've been taught to believe since an early age and have never questioned it. It just seems like an exit for those without any kind of thought or decision making process... 'And Jebus said: black is white'. 'Oh, is it? Ok'. I think the worst thing about chirtianity is the bible itself... You'd think that anyone who read the first few pages would immediately dispel it as clearly a work of fiction, maybe even a kids story book. The fact that anyone could even consider any of what is written after that to be true is laughable to me.It's not just christians of course, they're just the ones who I tend to be exposed to most in the UK. You'll be glad to know that since 2001 I've gained a good hatred of the Muslim 'faith' and the more I learn about their beliefs the more I see them as being maybe 500-1000 years behind modern society.Anyway, probably best not to delve much deeper into that... for christians on here, Hannah Shucksmith's always good for a bit of an argument discussion on the topic of how you can simultaneously believe in both evolution and creationism .We live in a free world, people can believe what they want to - you choose not to believe, others choose to. This doesn't mean they're stupid or bad people. Perhaps it means that they're minds are a little more open than yours and like to believe in something more than what is visable.But the thing is that they haven't come to believe through any kind of evidence, or mental enlightenment, they have simply been told (often early in life) 'This is the truth. There is no other possible truth. You will believe and defend this truth whenever anyone questions this truth'. That obviously doesn't make them bad people, but I do think it makes them incredibly gullible and, possibly, a little stupid for not questioning it.No matter what evidence is bought to light, no matter what you say, do or suggest to them won't make the slightest bit of difference - I'm sure they've heard anything you have to say a million times over."The first time someone calls you a horse you punch him in the nose, the second time someone calls you a horse you call him a jerk, but the third time someone calls you a horse, well then perhaps it's time to go shopping for a saddle."Edit: That Westboro Baptist Church... how is it that in America where they love their army and wars almost as much as they love their guns that they haven't shot the picketers at soldiers funerals and burnt the church down? Oh, yeah, they're also all stupid, god fearing folks too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 But the thing is that they haven't come to believe through any kind of evidence, mental enlightenment, they have simply been told (often early in life) 'This is the truth. There is no other possible truth. You will believe and defend this truth whenever anyone questions this truth'. That obviously doesn't make them bad people, but I do think it makes them incredibly gullible and, possibly, a little stupid for not questioning it.What about people who have a sudden faith? The older generation being a good example - when times were shit and uncertain, I'm sure most would have 'turned to God' for some hope in an otherwise dull environment.Chrisitainity does a lot of good too. Although I guess bad news makes the papers..."The first time someone calls you a horse you punch him in the nose, the second time someone calls you a horse you call him a jerk, but the third time someone calls you a horse, well then perhaps it's time to go shopping for a saddle."Haha, nice saying there. However being raised in a Christian environment, you would believe it all - but you simply wouldn't 'accept' somebodies comments of calling it bullshit after all that. If you managed to persaude a Christian that it was bollocks, would that dramatically alter your life? Would you get any sort of pleasure or satisfaction from it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 However being raised in a Christian environment, you would believe it all - but you simply wouldn't 'accept' somebodies comments of calling it bullshit after all that. If you managed to persaude a Christian that it was bollocks, would that dramatically alter your life? Would you get any sort of pleasure or satisfaction from it?So you're effectively brainwashed if you're brought up in that environment? Man that sounds like a good way to spend your life... It wouldn't alter my life in any way, but I'd be pleased to have saved someone from a life of lies and BS in order to open up their minds to the possibility that the Earth wasn't made by an old guy with a beard... It should be noted that I've always been a very logical person, I think I may be 1/4 Vulcan or something... anyway, maths, science etc make sense to me. Things have a logical order and using the basics of these you can make logical theories regarding the origins of the universe or whatever you fancy. The fact that religion, at it's very heart, is 100% illogical and almost fairytailesque I simply find it laughable. I'm sure if I'd been brought up in a christian environment I'd have also been brainwashed and would see things totally differently but I'm bloody glad I was left to make up my own mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Christians? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider Lad Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 We live in a free world, people can believe what they want to - you choose not to believe, others choose to. This doesn't mean they're stupid or bad people. Perhaps it means that they're minds are a little more open than yours and like to believe in something more than what is visable.No matter what evidence is bought to light, no matter what you say, do or suggest to them won't make the slightest bit of difference - I'm sure they've heard anything you have to say a million times over.I can assure you my friend, this is not open-mindedness. Something closer to blind ignorance, I'd say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronz Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 If you really want to learn about the flaws with Christianity (and religion in general) listen to Ricky Gervais Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Manual Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Or just read the bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Wood Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Arew you seroius?!!!You didn't read the rest of my post did you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannah Shucksmith Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Or just read the bible.Which won't actually give you much insight at all... I'm a Christian, I have strong faith in God yet in all honesty I don't follow everything that the bible tells me I should follow in order to be a good Christian.I'll answer anything with my own views if you so wish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Forgive me if I'm way off the mark here.. But by not following all that the Bible teaches you, surely that means you're not a Christian? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 The idea is there, but the commitment is missing....a bit like a prostitute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Manual Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Forgive me if I'm way off the mark here.. But by not following all that the Bible teaches you, surely that means you're not a Christian? Exactly. I just typed a whole load of shit, but that sums it up perfectly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannah Shucksmith Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Forgive me if I'm way off the mark here.. But by not following all that the Bible teaches you, surely that means you're not a Christian? No, infact, some of the things the bible contains are baddd! Infact, the bible contains lies and is very self contradictory. Stories of rape and murder are expressed within the bible, for example when Potiphar's wife lied to her own husband covering the truth of Joseph attempting to rape her, Abraham lies repeatedly about Sarah not being his wife and instead, his sister. Jacob lies to Issac to steal Esau's blessing and Joseph's brothers also lied to Jacob about something or other. Their only a few things I can think of off the top of my mind... There are three main groups that Christians can place themeselves in: Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant. I personally base myself in the third cateogory that is Protestantism; I am less extreme than catholics, for example, I believe in relative moraltiy, whereas you will find that catholics believe in absolute morality. I believe that it is perfectly acceptable to use contraception, to drink, to swear and all that, because I still believe in God, I put myself in Gods hands. I'm not hurting anybody else by believing in relative morality more so that absolute morality, and in some cases I am even looking to help others by believing in relative morality, for instance, in the case of rape and abortion.Just because I don't believe everything in the bible, does not make me a bad Christian, nor does it mean that I am not a Christian at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anzo Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 No, infact, some of the things the bible contains are baddd! ...............................Stories of rape and murder are expressed within the bibleYes, but it doesn't promote it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannah Shucksmith Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 Yes, but it doesn't promote it?Yet all the people to commit crime against Christianity in the bible were not punished. Some were, yes, but not all, which I suppose kind of illuminates to some that if a deciple can escape being punished for provacative behaviour then so can anyone? That's the way I see it anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDoom Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Nichols Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 I'm not too hot on religion but from what I understand the Christian faith is based entirely on the the teachings of the Bible. Everything that you believe in and everything that your faith stands for is originally from the book that you (Hannah) don't follow nor agree with entirely.. So basically, you aren't a Christian.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannah Shucksmith Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 I'm not too hot on religion but from what I understand the Christian faith is based entirely on the the teachings of the Bible. Everything that you believe in and everything that your faith stands for is originally from the book that you (Hannah) don't follow nor agree with entirely.. So basically, you aren't a Christian..My faith does not stand for murder or rape of which is contained within the bible! I'm a Christian, I believe in God, I believe in the 10 Commandments, I attend church, I pray, I turn to God for help when I need it and when others need it, I ask for forgivness of sins. I believe, I have faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroMatt Posted May 22, 2009 Report Share Posted May 22, 2009 lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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