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Brettoll

All round bike - do they exist anymore?

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Been out the game for a number of years and a few months back I purchased a TGS machine to get back into trials again. However the more I have been riding it, the more I am missing a bike that is a little more 'all round'.

So something a little shorter, but not full street? It can bunny hop AND back wheel without too much difficulty? May or may not have a seat?

Do they still exist?

I know there is an argument that with the right set up and practice you can do it all on one bike - with some prime examples.. however personal preference, I adored my black Ashton Justice, great GEO, worked as a bunny hopper and a back wheel machine!

 

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you just described an Inspired Hex 

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@Ali C  I had a hex and disagree. As a true all rounder, It was just too far street leaning in my opinion. 

Everything seems to be either one extreme or the other, with nothing in between anymore.

Ashton justice was always my go to all rounder. And especially since you know you like them, I would try and find one second hand.

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One built up with soft compound tyres and a slightly longer stem would be ideal I think 

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I had a quick ride on one a few years ago (I forget who owned it, sadly) with a more trialsy bar/stem, soft tyres (even softer than I used to run, which is saying something...) and F&R HS33s and it was a very hoppy machine. Felt hugely different to many others I've ridden and bounced around on one wheel just fine, though still rolled about better than most TGS/compy machines. Very much a middle ground, to be honest (Y)

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It does seem Hex is pretty much the only thing on modern market that would work.

Failing that, scouring sites for an Ashton that's not a shed.

I have to agree with Mikee a bit that it's almost become two ends of a spectrum, with not a lot in the middle anymore..

 

 

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Have a look at the Phatworks frames under development. There is a thread on here somewhere about them. Some great all round geo options, very nice brake options, modern tapered headtubes with different b/b height options. Being developed by a well know UK rider/desginer whos been in the scene for decades. Phatworks on Facebook is the way to go.

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Hey! 

Yeah you're right on with the PhatWorks Union 26 Frames - I wanted something exactly like you're suggesting and couldn't find it. Been working making other bikes for a few years so starting in March 2017, just designed my own. It started out very simple but but now we have something that's quite advanced. 

My 1065, 388, +15, 73 does feel a little too long, probably because I steepened the head angle without shortening the wheelbase. I'll be announcing the finalised geo soon, with a 380 back end, a smidge higher bb, shorter front end, and a some really nifty new features. 

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21 minutes ago, Phatmike said:

Hey! 

Yeah you're right on with the PhatWorks Union 26 Frames - I wanted something exactly like you're suggesting and couldn't find it. Been working making other bikes for a few years so starting in March 2017, just designed my own. It started out very simple but but now we have something that's quite advanced. 

My 1065, 388, +15, 73 does feel a little too long, probably because I steepened the head angle without shortening the wheelbase. I'll be announcing the finalised geo soon, with a 380 back end, a smidge higher bb, shorter front end, and a some really nifty new features. 

Already following you on FB anyway to see the development projects in play - will be keeping an eye out on the frames!

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An older hex, without the super street new geometry will do you well.

 

Put short/high bars and bunnyhop life is yours... Put a long low stem and pogo puff life is yours. but a mix of the two and you get a mix- something that bunnyhops and rear wheels fine.

 

It will do neither as well as a dedicated pogo puff or street bike, but it can do both. Love to see a  super carbon “clean” pogo bike take a mountain bike trail, skatepark and trials. Also is a nightmare riding natural competition with super short skye... 

 

the hex is just a fun bike, and honestly this old hex i have is better suited to comp riding over street... but i have it set up for bunnyhop chill life cuz im an old crusty bicycle rider. 

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the only thing I can think of that makes the newer hex better for street and worse for comps is the slightly shorter wheelbase, but that's only because the chainstays got made shorter which means it's now way better on the rear wheel than the previous one! 

I will admit that comp guys might prefer the rim brakes on the older one but I definitely think the newer geo is much better for natural riding (one reason why I asked for it).

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If anyone with a newer Hex wants to swap for my older one I'm happy to take one for the team ;)

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Just order one from Marino a year ago, then you’ll have it in 6 months or so. 

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1 minute ago, JD™ said:

Just order one from Marino a year ago, then you’ll have it in 6 months or so. 

Hahaha. Had a Marino a number of years ago.. was tempted again, then saw what was happening!

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Out of all the stuff I've had/built, the green hex I've got now is the best riding trials bike I've had, it can do all the stuff I want it to do and not leave me with the back and wrists of an 80 year old bloke

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Cheers all.

Wanted Ad is up for a Hex Frame to get me started. As the 2019 frame kit isn't on Tarty yet

Edited by Brettoll
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I thought I was the only one who thought people should be wearing full face helmets.

s for protection, it's at least as good as my protec ace, and it's full face. It's also at least as good as the old Gyro Switchblade that once saved my jaw and face from a nasty face plant years ago that left the rest of me really broken: my chin had a small abrasion from the inside of the helmet only.

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What do you think about the developments in geometries? 

A 71.5ish head angle used to be the norm across the board; and still is on most static-oriented bikes, whereas the streetier side of things is steadily pulling steeper without finding an equilibrium yet, like we seem to have done with the rise in bb height in the mid 00's. Maybe there's avenues to explore by going steeper still in both ends of the discipline.

3 degrees will make a huge difference in term of reach-adjusted wheelbase. With the addition of shorter back ends and lower offset forks, it will affect a lot of aspects of riding and highlight how a PX Zebdi is so different from a Hex, despite their similar wheelbase (to be corrected? What did the Zebdi's measure in at?).

Given that, and approaching my build with a slightly more trialsy angle (meaning a longer stem), I've actually settled on a wheelbase for the Union not too dissimilar from the Hex, with some tweaks to mine and Andy P's current frames (+ JJ's shorter version and Martin Pretorious' longer version) to make it the all-rounder it's shaping up to be. Luckily these tweaks suit a streetier build as well too, and we've had some great input there. 

As someone said in another topic about Jeff Anderson(?)'s negative rake (backwards) forks, to shorten the wheelbase with the same reach it seems there's more to consider. 

 

 

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This was always my go to for geo in the "old days" - so it depends which Zebdi you were aiming at?

http://free-du.htnet.hr/trials/frames.html

Planet X.JPG

Edited by Brettoll

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In my opinion I like the onza T-bird

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