Bike-trials, Past, Present And Future.

[Danny Kearns]

Ok so. Was on the train home back from Liverpool today and was having a really hard think and to be honest, this has been on my mind the past few weeks. So where to start.

First thing. I remember around 10-12 months ago. A ride topic used to be arranged and we used to get about 30 people together riding. I noticed this with Birmingham rides mainly. I mean what is happening ? Were stuggiling to get 7 people together nowa days. Which got me thinking, is trials really becomign that un-popular ?

I've noticed alot of difference in riders aswell, how people change etc, their ridings style's become completly different and it makes me think ? Why, everything was so much better back then, so mcuh more fun etc.

Which brings me on to another point. Older riding components. I've lost count of the amount of people who are requesting old Deng parts and saying they are the best. It just goes to show, the old stuff really is the best. But it also got me thinking, Deng obviously wants more sales, then why not give his customers what there requesting ? If you think we should start a petition thread on the matter, then simply reply that you think we should in here.

Riding just doesn't feel or seem the same anymore. Everythings changing and in my opinons...It's changing for the worst.......

Thoughts and discussion people.

Danny.

[Ryan.]

i agree with you about not being able to get loads of people to rides nowadays, however myself, i really like something new now and then, and the anticipation of waiting for the new years range of bits to come out, yeh i wouldn't mind some old bits being re-released, but i guarantee as soon as people are given what they want , there gonna want something new.

Ryan

[B.E.A.U]

I hate the ride part i love huge group rides man. dont really happen no more

[Tom Booth]

Have you. Thought its. Still early. In the year? The weather is. Still horrible, so. People aren't really. Willing to. Venture 40-50. Miles by train to. Discover its crap. Weather. Wait until. Summer and rides. Will grow into. Mass group rides.

[Sponge]

As I said on MSN, but i'll repeat it here.

Things have changed so much. I first started riding back in late 04, my first group ride was a London one, where I could barely even hop. But they were still the best times. Socially speaking, they were so enjoyable, I mean the atmosphere in London rides is totally, totally different. Back then, riders from all over used to flock to London to ride, and the majority were really awesome people. That's when I first met people like Chai, Hardman brothers, Matt Staples, Ben Cox, Stephen Morris, Adrian Jordan, just to name a few off the top of my head. I remember my first ride well, and I wish things could go back to the way things were. Things were chilled, and none of that overkill TGS-2007/8 stuff.

As for components, lots of come and gone. I must say I preferred Deng's smaller but neater range back when I first knew about trials bikes. The beginnings of the CNC rims, the first few prototype shots of the 'revolutionary' 2005 python without a bashplate which stirred up much controversy on all the forums. mmm, those were the days.

I'll send Deng some emails about old parts. To be honest, it'd be so much better if he concentrated his energy into doing this for example:

-in terms of headsets, don't make 5 brand versions in colours, just release ONE super high-quality and well-thought out headset under the main Echo brand. We're talking Tensile Ace headset-esque quality and research. Just like a nice clean black headset by Echo with top-grade quality and materials, maybe CNC'd scoops around the cups to give a nice finish, but yeah that'd be heaps better than pouring the money into 5-brand headsets which are all identical in performance. Quality rather than quanitity please. If you appreciated the simplicity and subtle quality of the older components, then do email him as well. The more emails the better. Do you remember how outrage from OTN pretty much FORCED Deng into bringing back 135mm stock frames instead of having just 116mm modstocks for 07? Pressure has worked in the past, and it sure can do now.

[Ben John-Hynes]

Mint post Danny,

It really got me thinking!

I've only been riding a year and a half but i've still noticed the decrease in numbers of riders coming to rides,

I remember, even in the winter/spring, that more people were coming out riding,

And the summer rides were just stupidly large!

I think that the competition participation rate has grown too,

So that may be taking away from the size of city/town rides!

And with all of the different and appealing types of riding,

a lot of trials riders are venturing off and having a go at other types.

It's sadenning,

Hopefully, rides this summer will be as fun and large as last years rides!

As for the components,

I think that Deng doesn't want to feel as if he's going backwards in time,

so he keeps trying to bring out better and more updated parts,

and doesn't listen to the people who buy them.

I think that we will see some of the older components being re-released just as a major money maker for him!

Both points you made are really interesting when you think about it!

Ben

Edit:

So it's turned out that riding back in the day,

Parts and Rides/Riding wise were much more, highly thought of,

And "better"!

Edited March 25, 2008 by Benjaminge

[trials_pimp]

Its nothing too new, trials seems to have waves.

There will be a point where everyone is doing it, then sudenly everyones quit.

When I 1st started (1999) I saw 2 other people riding, then during my 1 couple years we would ride with about 10-15 riders every week, and that was just local people. Group rides would eaily double that.

Now im lucky if I dont have to ride alone, everyone has sold their bikes, done other things. But then this happened a while back, then people started again, they bough newer bikes and came out once more. Not looking as hopefull these days as all of the riders round here are too old, got jobs and homes to look after.

Trials was also alot better years ago because it was harder. in 99 all you could ride was a small XC bike or a Cannondale if you were rich.

There was 2/3 VHS videos to watch, and learning new things took months.

Now look, you can pick an off the peg trials bike for £200, find 100,000's videos online. Ive seen people riding for as little as a year become better than me.

Riders now watch a couple vids of someone good, and copy it.

Look at what happened when Craig Lee Scott hit the Scene, He was picking over things, then suddenly so was everyone else, Neil tuniclife went bigger, people followed. Trials moves are becoming Fads: Picks, taps, sidehops, tap-90 ect

And what the hell is all this TGS??, what does it even mean?

What hapened to people going riding with no knowlage and learning by accident? Trial was more fun when it was hard

[ben_travis]

TGS = Tap gap sidehop. - Basically sum's up styles of riders like me.

However, im going to say that finally, this could be a decent topic. I have opinions on all the replies so far, but im working and cant be arsed going into them yet.

However i will say, that i agree with trials_pimp - trials goes through waves, and this generally has to do with the weather.

But i will also say is that i am enjoying riding natural more than street at the moment, so much more challenging, keeps you fitter, and generally more relaxed than street rides.

However, i know everyone around here / most of scotland, and i know that riding with them we spend as much time slagging each other off as we do riding. The banter is so much fun.

Basically, i think trials in scotland went through its 'slump' last year, and now its getting more popular again, older riders are coming back when they realise that the scene is not a serious one. We just like a laugh.

I think other points in this topic are waaaaaay off, but everyone is entitled to an opinon.

Edited March 25, 2008 by ben_travis

[Greetings]

Which brings me on to another point. Older riding components. I've lost count of the amount of people who are requesting old Deng parts and saying they are the best. It just goes to show, the old stuff really is the best.

I don't really think that's true. In the old days, most parts were weak and useless and Deng introduced ones that were so much more durable and trials specific than what other brands had to offer. By comparison, they were the best.

Now that trials has progressed I'm pretty sure you'll find his old stuff would be no good comparing to what is sold nowadays.

[Janson]

I remember when TGS was called just pure trials...

Also, if Deng started selling his old stuff because some people prefer it to his new stuff, he would totally shoot himself in his foot because he would openly admit his later products are worse than the older ones. And if he would start bringing old stuff back he'd be able to spend less time and money making NEW stuff. I mean, I'd rather see him make new and hopefully better stuff instead of making all the old shit again.

[MattB]

Saw a car yesterday with the numberplate "TGS 3" lol.

But yeah I agree with danny less people come out.

A year and half ago get in from school and go on msn and almost instantly a ride was organised and I was out riding by half 4 with about 10 people.

Now I stuggle to get people out and generally no one can be bothered anymore.

Hopefully good weather will get poeple out.

Matt

Edited March 25, 2008 by MattB

[Tomm]

Saw a car yesterday with the numberplate "TGS 3" lol.

Was probably Ben Travis in his Hummer H2, all paid for by Deng, of course.

[ben_travis]

Was probably Ben Travis in his Hummer H2, all paid for by Deng, of course.

LMFAO....haha

[anzo]

I keep seeing more riders if anything! I drove through Matlock yesterday and saw 3 lads with trials bikes (one with the yellow wheels), and drove through again the week before (more Buxton) and saw a GU on a car roof rack.

Perhaps its a Derbyshire thing, but I always see new riders out and about.

[Tom Booth]

I keep seeing more riders if anything! I drove through Matlock yesterday and saw 3 lads with trials bikes (one with the yellow wheels), and drove through again the week before (more Buxton) and saw a GU on a car roof rack.

Perhaps its a Derbyshire thing, but I always see new riders out and about.

Was one of them a Toxsin mod ad another an Ozony's? I met them on the way back from Buxton, sound lads.

[Tomm]

It moves about though. I remember ages ago there were loads of riders in Lancaster who would be out every weekend. And then some moved away from Lancaster but there was another little pocket of riders (E.g. in Manchester). Now some of the Manchester people have moved away to uni or stopped riding. People move about - trials in the UK hasn't stopped just because your little riding group is no more.

[N.Wood]

I disagree with the majority of what the OP said.

There are bound to be peaks and troughs in the number os trials riders in your area. As has been mentioned, its spring incase you hadn't noticed. The past few months have been full of shitty weather where no one wants to ride. There more more riders around yesterday than there has been for ages, that doesn't mean trials is becoming really popular in Plymouth, it means its the Easter holiday.

New components are loads better than old components, only you're new to the sport so don't realise it.

I agree with Sponge that sometimes the atmosphere on some of the bigger rides isn't the same as it used to be back in the day with riders like Stephen Morris, Tim Rodriguez, Staples, Chai when he was like 12 were around and we were all learning, developing our own style and moves.

[trialsalot]

see my post in the tuckage pics topic (67th page)

craig

[Bearded Midget]

i wasnt really around when the older stuff was still about and before this so called "TGS" was around, but i can agree with the whole "trials goes through waves thing"

when i started in braintree it went from about 3 riders up to about 20, then half a year later it was down to 2 of us, then all of a sudden a few older riders have got back into it and are picking it up again, so it turned to about 5 of us, and now a couple more people have started riding who are new to trials, so now in braintree there are 9 of us who ride, and when we do go riding its usually above 5 people who are out (mainly because steve lives like 10 miles away from the town, and charlie is very similar) so those 2 can only ride when they can get a lfit in the car. so braintree is starting to pick itself up again i guess.

also i think less people ride in general because they get bored of the same stuff, e.g im gettin rather bored of braintree town as there are only a few spots and i love riding natural in any case and abviously the weather at the momnent isnt very nice. if it was bright blue sky i would probably go out and ride right now, but seeing as it looks like it could rain im not gunnu go out maybe after tea

on the other hand even though ive never used old stuff such as stems etc, i wouldnt want them back as the new stuff is clearly extremely strong, with the zoo frames on the other hand, they could be made with the same geo as the old ones as they are obviously lovely from the comments i have read, but he could slightly change the design and make it to a higher quality standard. that way deng isnt admitting new stuff is crap as somebody said, and also its technically a new product as it will be visually different.

rant over,

Reece x

[Muel]

Was one of them a Toxsin mod ad another an Ozony's? I met them on the way back from Buxton, sound lads.

Court and Wes! Legends, we rode Matlock with them on Friday.

[ogre]

trials is growing in my area 2 oldschool lads are back, and me and matt [started together] havent stopped in 2 and a half years

[Luke Rainbird]

trials is growing in my area 2 oldschool lads are back, and me and matt [started together] havent stopped in 2 and a half years

You must be very tired...

I agree that the concepts of some older parts (the look of some, the geo of others etc) may have been better than the current run of stuff, and also that the newer bits and bobs have advantages in terms of strength and technology.

Any manufacturer needs to find a way to take the good points from each, and apply this so as to minimise the downsides. '04 Short Control geo, few more modern features, winner.

[Mark W]

Ok so. Was on the train home back from Liverpool today and was having a really hard think and to be honest, this has been on my mind the past few weeks. So where to start.

First thing. I remember around 10-12 months ago. A ride topic used to be arranged and we used to get about 30 people together riding. I noticed this with Birmingham rides mainly. I mean what is happening ? Were stuggiling to get 7 people together nowa days. Which got me thinking, is trials really becomign that un-popular ?

I've noticed alot of difference in riders aswell, how people change etc, their ridings style's become completly different and it makes me think ? Why, everything was so much better back then, so mcuh more fun etc.

Which brings me on to another point. Older riding components. I've lost count of the amount of people who are requesting old Deng parts and saying they are the best. It just goes to show, the old stuff really is the best. But it also got me thinking, Deng obviously wants more sales, then why not give his customers what there requesting ? If you think we should start a petition thread on the matter, then simply reply that you think we should in here.

Riding just doesn't feel or seem the same anymore. Everythings changing and in my opinons...It's changing for the worst.......

Thoughts and discussion people.

Danny.

Only real thoughts I've got on that post are ,; and maybe /

Trials was also alot better years ago because it was harder. in 99 all you could ride was a small XC bike or a Cannondale if you were rich.

There was 2/3 VHS videos to watch, and learning new things took months.

I wouldn't say trials was easier though - like you said, newer kids can get those newer bikes and go bigger now, but that's pushing the limits of their machinery the same way you were pushing the limits of your's. It's all relative

Saw a car yesterday with the numberplate "TGS 3" lol.

But yeah I agree with danny less people come out.

A year and half ago get in from school and go on msn and almost instantly a ride was organised and I was out riding by half 4 with about 10 people.

Now I stuggle to get people out and generally no one can be bothered anymore.

Hopefully good weather will get poeple out.

Matt

People get older and get more interested in other stuff, I guess. I just can't believe that in London it takes so long to get a group ride organised. It really, really surprises me...

[andyb]

This is a top thread so i thought a would stick my side in.

Basically i can agree with the deng situation, i had an a2 when they came out and loved it, but i find his frames especially are getting heavier all the time, and there is no new ideas from the factory anymore, it is for this reason that i have now bought an XTP2. I wanted a bike that looked like there had been some real thought put into and the new xtp seemed to fit the bill, also bloody light.

On the rider side of things though, down on the south coast where im from, there seems to be more riders all the time, it seems to be going from strength to strength. And i still feel that riding down here is very light hearted and good fun, when we went to London in january we all thought it was a bit split up and were very dissapointed. It seems we will stick to pompey and soton and have a top day with our mates.

It seems that the decline of trials is a regional thing and all areas will have strong times and weak times, having never been up north to ride i dont know what its like. But we will be there for the vince ride.

Andy b

[sidehop]

However, i know everyone around here / most of scotland, and i know that riding with them we spend as much time slagging each other off as we do riding. The banter is so much fun.

Basically, i think trials in scotland went through its 'slump' last year, and now its getting more popular again, older riders are coming back when they realise that the scene is not a serious one. We just like a laugh.

All we do is laugh Trav....

And ocationaly ride ofcourse.....