Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Still waiting for answers to my questions btw :'( My bad We don't really have a judge saying trials or not for each rider I just hear the "accused" saying how it isn't fair that they are being branded as not trials And in all honesty I'm just sick of strangers asking me to do a 360 down a stair set or wanting I know if Danny Macaskill is my mate ? It ain't trials !!! Mark I was referring more towards the style of riding not setup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1a2bcio8 Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 If you can't see the similarities between a 24" brake less bike such as an inspired and a bmx then I'm afraid you have problems Moreover from watching your videos I see no more than I would in a bmx edit Please don't think I'm having a dig at your riding I also ride bmx and I think you have banging style BUT ... That ain't trials boy Do you not recognise that trials means what we want it to? Essentially you are choosing to define in that way - it's not necessary that you do so - whilst some of us want to include a more bmx orientated style within the definition because we like being a part of this community. I still backhop and do an array of other 'trialsy' moves when I also do 360s, etc. We use language for convenience of communication; for achieving certain things - that is all. There's no ultimate trials reality... but unfortunately that misconception is what underlies all these arguments. It's as though people are seeing 'trials' as some definite thing and not just a made up label. This is why I called the GETcreative competition 'freetrials' because it still communicates being a part of the same community but without limits as to what you add to your riding. Obviously never caught on though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 As I said before though, there shouldn't be a limit to what a trials rider can do. you've made a choice with your bike setup that allows you to do some moves bigger/further but you've sacrificed the ability to bunnyhop and spin well. I have absolutely no problems with that at all. The only issue I have is that people who can ride on rocks AND do 360 bunnyhops get told we're riding over sized BMXs and don't ride trials. I completely understand that some moves have come from BMX but that's the beauty of the types of bike we ride, we can do it all and that's the fundamental spirit of trials that attracted me at the start. I'd argue that my 24" inspired is more of a trials bike in the purest essence than a long bike that actually makes a lot of things impossible, but again I have no issue with long bikes (I rode one for years) but I think people need to accept there's more than one way to ride a bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Aside from all the zen "do what you want" stuff the get creative comp (although being great to watch and keep up to date with) was in my opinion purely dedicated to a street trials style of filming .. I didn't see any serious tgs videos winning prizes ? I understand the creativity behind the riding but is there a place for displays of pure talent or physical exertion ? Ie a vid by Damon or neil t ? The majority of stuff I see done in comps like that is stuff that can be done on a Bmx or 24/26" street bike You would ride a comp on west lakes bike then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I'm sure if Damon or Neil actually entered with a good creative video they'd have done really well, If people don't enter they won't win. I may have mis-read you but "is there a place for displays of pure talent?" Are you suggesting that people who ride TGS are the only ones with "pure talent"? Again I may not have got read that in the way intended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I'm regarding the difference between the creative style of riding preferred by inspired lovers and the meticulous inch hunting (or call it what you like) preferred by kids with no seats and nobbly tyres .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 EDIT: So, there were a load of posts between Jo replying and me replying, making most of this redundant --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Arguably it is where "street trials" or whatever you want to call it is going though. I don't think many people really care about "not being branded as trials" just because it makes no difference to anything. I disagree with what a lot of people on here would classify as trials, but changing the label doesn't change the content. For example, you mentioned before that you see my videos and "see no more than I would in a bmx edit". I'm only using this video as it's pretty short and I can remember filming some of the lines in it... https://vimeo.com/34092903 The first clip I have in it is a wodge to rear. At around 1:50-ish there's a sort of double-up line going up the Moon Rocks. Around the 2min mark there's a hooky-type thing to rear. This isn't an attempt by me to go 'Check me out' or anything like that because I don't really think my riding in this video is particularly good, but those are trials moves that you won't see in any BMX videos (Mike Mastroni and Tate Roskelley have done some vaguely wodge-type stuff in their latest videos, but it's not quite the same. Ironically, they're also called trials riders by BMXers...). You complained about Danny's video making people who don't understand the nuances of trials riding think that you should be able to do 360s, but then you say that my videos are essentially just BMX videos despite most of my lines containing trials moves of some sort. I've ridden trials and BMX for over a decade and I like to mix those influences together, but I'd say that deep down I'm still a trials rider which is why all the moves I do on my 24 are totally different to what I used to do on my BMX, and why I look at spots in a different way to a BMXer (and a trials rider for some). Again, I'm not really bothered about it as this sort of chat doesn't change anything, it's just 'interesting' in a way. Especially so bearing in mind when the TrialsKings videos were released almost a decade ago there was a backlash against them because they did manuals and stuff and people - me included, ironically - said that it "Wasn't trials". The "Not trials" stuff they had in their videos is now deemed acceptable and pretty standard fare, e.g. Joe Maher doing mannys to up-to-fronts in his last video. The boundaries are always going to get pushed and the way people look at things is always going to change. I don't get annoyed that people classify what I do as BMX because it makes no difference whether they do or don't, but in situations like this I still like to try and find out where people are coming from. For example, you originally said that my Inspired was an "oversized BMX", but now that's changed to it just being me riding it like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1a2bcio8 Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Aside from all the zen "do what you want" stuff the get creative comp (although being great to watch and keep up to date with) was in my opinion purely dedicated to a street trials style of filming .. I didn't see any serious tgs videos winning prizes ? I understand the creativity behind the riding but is there a place for displays of pure talent or physical exertion ? Ie a vid by Damon or neil t ? The majority of stuff I see done in comps like that is stuff that can be done on a Bmx or 24/26" street bike You would ride a comp on west lakes bike then ? Yet the winner of a novice category, Jonathan Tollerud, had a very trialsy style. I also rode the nationals on my 24" at Radfest which was on a bike fairly similar to Marks. Albeit with brakes. The fundamental point here is, what do you want to achieve by saying that style that some of us ride isn't to be included as part of the definition of trials? If you can give me a good reason I will happily stop saying that I am a part of a trials community. I struggle to imagine what a good achievement of that would be though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I didn't see any serious tgs videos winning prizes ? The guy who won the non-sponsored category did it on a 'real' trials bike. He gave it a go and ended up winning. There wasn't anything stopping anyone else doing that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isitafox Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Right I've skimmed over 90% of the bollocks being spouted in here. Basically I'm sick of the whole trials/street/tgs/bmx crap that is constantly getting brought up on here. A lot of street trials vids are filmed in a skate park on ramps, there's a clip of Jack Meek in GET2 doing a line including some ramps so what's the problem? People make comments regarding what is and isn't trials purely to start an argument most of the time when there's no need for it. Even if there is a bmx influence in how someone rides, who cares?! It's not hurting anyone is it? If someone is having fun and is proud of their riding and wants to showcase it then who are we to put them down. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 When it comes down to it I agree with the comment above .. All of this is complete bollocks .. Everyone is sick of this argument .. But it is an argument for a reason . I would love to have this conversation without the hassle of a phone or keyboard to interfere ! But mark do you agree tyre slides out of 180s possibly may not be "proper trials" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark W Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Does that mean when I do a hook it's BMX? Or am I only a trials rider when I'm doing a backhop, sidehop, hook or something like that? Does "what I am" change as I'm mid-way through a line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinkdougie Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Maybe the videos section should have a sub forum? TGS and Street videos? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Maybe the videos section should have a sub forum? TGS and Street videos? I think there just needs to be a shouting topic, where anything can be said without spoiling peoples topics or offending. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 tyre slides out of 180s possibly may not be "proper trials" but they feel sooo good! Plus it's a highly efficient way of turning around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD™ Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Maybe the videos section should have a sub forum? TGS and Street videos? YEA FOR SEGREGATION. None of us lot like all styles of riding anyway... It's ironic that it's always the 'TGS' lot who start throwing the stones, without thinking that to some people it's actually their style of riding that is nothing like trials to some of us. People like Mark, or probably more realistically Sean, are at one end of the 'not trials' spectrum and you lot who don't actually ride lines at all and just do three moves on a bike are at the other. Then there's all of the rest of us who are in the middle (and/or can't ride at all). It's all trials, or not trials. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 but they feel sooo good! Plus it's a highly efficient way of turning around. Agreed yes they do .. On a Bmx It should be physically impossible to do on a trials .. I hve a Bmx for doing spins etc .. If I did a try slide I reckon my front wheel would bend and or forks would snap And my hat would fall off .. And after that I would post about it on my super cool and individual blog that noones heard about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmertrials Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 (edited) To me this whole segregation is nothing to do with what bike/style you ride. It's down to a select few who have singlehandedly divided themselves and decided that only their (or their following) opinions are worthwhile. I reallllly couldn't care about how you ride, as I stated it's all fun. Edited March 26, 2013 by harmertrials 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsiain Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Ive always just thought of it as two different things - Trials - street trials 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Agreed yes they do .. On a Bmx It should be physically impossible to do on a trials .. I hve a Bmx for doing spins etc .. If I did a try slide I reckon my front wheel would bend and or forks would snap And my hat would fall off .. And after that I would post about it on my super cool and individual blog that noones heard about Why should it? If you're worried you're going to damage your bike doing them then you're obviously not very skilled at them and should practice more, though admittedly it will be harder on a bike set up for natural, but not impossible. Your replies seem to be going down hill a little now, perhaps half cab sliders are the limit of what you call trials? Though I'd still disagree as it's just a way of turning around rather than a "trick". Taking the piss out of having a blog is poor form too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo Prattley Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I'm taking the piss out of you Ali not your blog .. That's nothing to do with the bike you ride that's to do with your personality .. My forks are carbon and my front wheel is 28 hole .. So not designed for slides particularly My arguments are going down hill beacause I'm at work and beacause I'm really bored of this argument .. If you would like to have a conversation about it then I would much rather do it in perso. Where nobody can hide behind their keyboards I don't mean that in a threatening sense at all by the way ! I just think its easy to type something you don't care about As much as you think you are the life and soul of this forum Ali you are actually the main offender in its demise .. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trialarn Posted March 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 All TGS haters out there, act like adults please! I dont think you guys are like five years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bing Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 If only Andeee could reply to this, one can't help but to think of the gems that would come from him 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I'm taking the piss out of you Ali not your blog .. That's nothing to do with the bike you ride that's to do with your personality .. My forks are carbon and my front wheel is 28 hole .. So not designed for slides particularly My arguments are going down hill beacause I'm at work and beacause I'm really bored of this argument .. If you would like to have a conversation about it then I would much rather do it in perso. Where nobody can hide behind their keyboards I don't mean that in a threatening sense at all by the way ! I just think its easy to type something you don't care about As much as you think you are the life and soul of this forum Ali you are actually the main offender in its demise .. 1) I don't have a blog 2) sliders done right don't flex wheel or forks 3) so am I 4) I'm not hiding behind anything 5) I don't think I'm the life and soul of anything forum related, I don't post on here that often, only when I see really cool things, or really bad things. I'm not sure how you possibly get the idea I'm the demise of anything? I didn't start this argument and the only reason it's carrying on is that you continue to post things that segregate riders. I like EVERY type of riding yet because some people come and post bullshit and I end up defending myself or the type of trials I enjoy doing at the moment I get labelled as "negative". If a few narrow minded people saw trials as a whole rather than just the type they do then everyone would be much happier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FamilyBiker Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 this is what they do to this forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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