Tom Booth Posted January 24, 2022 Report Share Posted January 24, 2022 9 hours ago, AdamR28 said: I'm glad the media didn't try and specifically report him as a 'Covid death' like they have other celebrities. Didn't see the front page of the Sun Saturday then? (Can't blame you, it was at my grandparents...) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted January 24, 2022 Report Share Posted January 24, 2022 Ha, no I didn't. "Obese old man who lived a very unhealthy life dies". Hardly a headline. /autism 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT! Posted January 25, 2022 Report Share Posted January 25, 2022 On 1/23/2022 at 3:18 PM, MadManMike said: If you're playing it like that: I'm not, it was a throwaway comment. Honestly I thought meatloaf had died of a heart attack on stage years ago. Amazed he was still alive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/covid19deathsandautopsiesfeb2020todec2021 Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 Not thoughts, just plotted. Totals: Men: 3362; Women: 2821 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manuel Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 That’s a small number is my only thought. However, not hugely surprising as underlying health conditions are very likely to be mentioned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamR28 Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 I think that's the point - it seems that very, very few die of Covid when they haven't got an underlying health condition. Ie. healthy people have (virtually) nothing to worry about. Would be interesting to know what % of the population do have a recorded underlying health issue. Edit: "On 5 March 2019, 24.4% of the UK population were at risk due to a record of at least one underlying health condition" https://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-021-10427-2  Here comes some probably skewed maths...  So 25% of 67 million UK population have an underlying health condition = 16.75m Therefore 75% don't = 50.25m  Total UK deaths (since the start - nearly 2 years) with Covid mentioned = 155k Total deaths from the 'healthy' 75% = 6183 = 0.0123% = 1 in 8127 Therefore total deaths in the 25% = 149k = 0.89% = 1 in 112  Seems fairly clear - be healthy, don't die from Covid.  From 2016-2019, there were consistently ~250,000 deaths every year in the UK from cancer, alzheimers and heart disease: https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/totaldeathsintheukin2020anddeathsfromheartattacksheartdiseasecancerandalzheimersanddementia2016to2020  Still think Covid has been blown way out of proportion, and we should have focused on making people healthier to prevent rather than cure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete.M Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 There's a significant number of people who didn't die, but have long term side effects. I don't think there are accurate figures out there, but it's important to be aware of this. I can't really agree with it being blown out of proportion. Consider that hospitals around the world suddenly became overloaded, and the unthinkable number of deaths. That's a serious pandemic. But I can agree about encouraging people to be as healthy as possible. Things are a little better now, with omicron. But it still frustrates me to see so many people acting like it totally doesn't matter any more, when they could be carelessly spreading it to vulnerable people. Not directed at anyone here of course. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 18 minutes ago, Pete.M said: I can't really agree with it being blown out of proportion. Consider that hospitals around the world suddenly became overloaded, and the unthinkable number of deaths. That's a serious pandemic. But is it though? From the UK numbers we're currently showing over 155,000 deaths from/with Covid yet the ONS numbers say that only 6000 actually died of Covid as the only cause. In typical TF flawed maths news that means the global 5.6M deaths could be less than 250,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete.M Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 If 6000 was highly accurate, then yes I might feel as though it's not quite as severe as initially suggested. There's so many variables, it's hard to trust any figure. And again, I suspect there are more people with long term side effects than we realise. Another thing that's impossible to quantify. There's a good amount of research going into the long term effects, so there must be a reason for that. (Haven't personally read this research, but a family member keeps an eye on it) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 It's going to be very interesting to see what the history books say about Covid in 20 years for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manuel Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 I guess, we don’t know what ‘covid only’ on the death certificate really means. It could be that a large number could have pneumonia listed alongside covid (for example)? The only other thing I would say is how many people have an underlying health issue that they don’t know about?  I'm not really adding anything here other than these stats might not be ultra reliable.  But certainly they point towards health being massively significant, which is why I would be on a vaccine side (as a sort of healthy person) as it decreases transmission to those at higher risk without putting me at increased risk. (Sorry vax chat) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyksett Posted January 28, 2022 Report Share Posted January 28, 2022 Just to echo Pete M, there's a lot more impact related to Covid besides deaths. Long term side effects can be crippling, hospitals being full with cases impacts everyone else that needs to go to the hospital (A big reason to get boosted/get the vax), healthcare workers have been getting destroyed the last two years, etc. Hard to really quantify all this but it's a lot more than just looking at the death numbers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 I know he's Marmite and sometimes dismissed purely because of who he is, but this is very interesting. I'd like to hear peoples thoughts on this. Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 Are people only just realising this is a thing? Funny how people who were cancelled, ridiculed, fired, bullied and called conspiracy theorists are slowly starting to make sense. Also funny how the virus seems to have just ended? In the UK at least I'm no longer seeing much talk about it, obviously the Ukraine news is taking over but that's another story altogether. All I will say is it's nice that the covid passports have been abolished, I went to the cinema the other day and go mask free in shops etc and it feels great. I do worry that the decisions made up to this point have done more damage than the virus would've (after 2020 anyway) and I hope some of the more wild conspiracy theories aren't true but there's not much I can do about it anyway so I'm just going to enjoy the lesser restrictions and hope that other countries follow suite...it's been a wild ride! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 13 minutes ago, Ali C said: Are people only just realising this is a thing? For the most part, yes. To many, the unvaxxed are still mass murderers (Seriously, I was called that a couple of times!). I'm hoping that a few people I know say "You were right after all", but I doubt it. It is interesting that vaccines didn't cure Covid, but Russia invading Ukraine did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali C Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 38 minutes ago, MadManMike said: Â It is interesting that vaccines didn't cure Covid, but Russia invading Ukraine did. I wanted to say this but wasn't sure how well that would go down...not saying anything but I do know a few foil hats are twitching Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 30 minutes ago, Ali C said: I wanted to say this but wasn't sure how well that would go down...not saying anything but I do know a few foil hats are twitching I don't actually believe that that's true, but it does highlight just how much influence the media has over decisions made. The media decides to cover the conflict so the spotlight is taken away from Covid, which naturally means people will take it less seriously. I suspect it's the same reason there's so much fundraising for Ukraine but not for other countries that are in conflict, but that's a totally fresh can of worms. Covid restrictions only ramped up like they did and for as long as they did because of media hype. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topsy Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 I'm glad that we actually had a short period between restrictions being lifted and the new top news, so it wasn't quite a 1:1 swap here. Covid hasn't gone though and most people I've spoken to know that too but are enjoying their freedom which is nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT! Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 Has anyone ever really doubted getting covid will make you immune to it? The whole point of getting the vaccine is to become immune and not get sick from covid, as opposed to getting sick from covid and becoming immune. Â Â On 1/28/2022 at 9:33 AM, monkeyseemonkeydo said: Not thoughts, just plotted. Graph shows women live longer than men. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeyseemonkeydo Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 19 minutes ago, JT! said: Graph shows women live longer than men. It was more the overall numbers. In the UK the 'official' deaths linked to COVID to December '21 was ~150,000 yet the ONS numbers showing COVID as the only cause of death was only ~6000. A huge discrepancy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT! Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 17 hours ago, monkeyseemonkeydo said: It was more the overall numbers. In the UK the 'official' deaths linked to COVID to December '21 was ~150,000 yet the ONS numbers showing COVID as the only cause of death was only ~6000. A huge discrepancy. Sure, but that's down to what we quantify as a covid death right? Like, no one dies from a car accident, they die because they've lost too much blood, they stopped breathing or their head is no longer attached to their body, but we list it as a death due to a car accident. Kind of the same thing with covid. Sure, a lot of people who died from covid in the last 2 years would have died from something else anyway, but if covid was never a thing, I'd certainly imagine there'd be closer to 150,000 more people about now as opposed to 6000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 35 minutes ago, JT! said: Sure, but that's down to what we quantify as a covid death right? Like, no one dies from a car accident, they die because they've lost too much blood, they stopped breathing or their head is no longer attached to their body, but we list it as a death due to a car accident. Kind of the same thing with covid. Sure, a lot of people who died from covid in the last 2 years would have died from something else anyway, but if covid was never a thing, I'd certainly imagine there'd be closer to 150,000 more people about now as opposed to 6000. That's not a great analogy though - the loss of blood was directly because of the car crash. Dying of a heart attack 20 days after Covid might not have been as a direct result of having Covid. Deaths are not accurately reported, it's that simple. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT! Posted March 12, 2022 Report Share Posted March 12, 2022 On 3/11/2022 at 7:43 AM, MadManMike said: Deaths are not accurately reported, it's that simple. Well, sure but that's neither here nor there. We're talking about what is considered a covid death or not. The numbers 150k and 6k aren't due to an inaccuracy, they're due to two different definitions of a 'covid death'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadManMike Posted March 13, 2022 Report Share Posted March 13, 2022 21 hours ago, JT! said: Well, sure but that's neither here nor there. We're talking about what is considered a covid death or not. The numbers 150k and 6k aren't due to an inaccuracy, they're due to two different definitions of a 'covid death'. How can the definition of a Covid death be anything other than a death due to Covid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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